Artillian Tractor
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 14

Thread: Converting a 3PH log splitter to run off of tractor hydraulics

  1. Top | #1

    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Last Online
    08-10-2014 @ 05:57 AM
    Location
    PA, USA
    Posts
    1,974
    Thanks
    435
    Thanked 169 Times in 143 Posts

    Converting a 3PH log splitter to run off of tractor hydraulics

    I have a few questions on 3ph log splitters. At present I have a homebuilt splitter that uses a Prince HC-PTO-1AC 21 gpm PTO pump to power the splitter. The cylinder is 4"x24" with a 2" rod for about a 20-ton rating. One issue with it is that due to the size of the pump, and the fact that I don't have a cooler on it, the pump and fluid heat up fairly quickly when running the splitter. Of course, the cycle time for the splitter is measured in single-digit seconds.

    To use this splitter I obviously need to be running my tractor (a 2520). I have toyed with the idea of converting the splitter over to use tractor hydraulics. And now for my questions.

    The hydraulic gpm for the 2520 is split between the power steering (5.5 gpm), and the implements (5 gpm). If the tractor is just sitting there running, is the full 10.5 gpm available for implements, or is 5 gpm always the max, no matter what else the tractor is doing?

    My splitter has a control valve mounted to it right next to the cylinder. To use it, there must be full pressure available at the valve. At present my 2520 only has the standard hydraulic couplers under the right floorboards where the FEL hooks up. What do I need to get pressurized fluid to the rear of the tractor to hook up the splitter, and approximately how much does this cost?

    I will admit, even though the Prince pump is capable of putting out 20+ gpm, when I ran it with my old 40U, I would run it barely above idle, so I wasn't using anywhere near the full gpm of the pump. I'm not sure how happy I would be with only 5 gpm, but if it means all I need to do is plug in two hydraulic lines, I could probably live with it. My main concern is the cost. Of course, I'm not sure how happy my 2520 PTO would be with a 50 pound Prince pump hanging off of it, and the pump technically requires 32HP for max output and pressure. Also, I need to add a cooler to my current setup, which will cost a few hundred clams, so either way I'm going to end up spending money.

    Decisions, decisions. Anyone have any input or opinions????
    Andy B.

    1966 110 Lawn Tractor
    2012 2520 - DELIVERED 27APR2012!!!

    Tractor that I used to own - 1954 40 Utility
    KB3WPN

  2. # ADS
    GTT News
    Join Date
    Always
    Location
    GreenTractorTalk
    Posts
    Ads Only
     

  3. Top | #2
    dieselshadow's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Last Online
    Yesterday @ 10:00 PM
    Location
    Joelton TN
    Posts
    7,243
    Thanks
    585
    Thanked 1,108 Times in 839 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by andy b. View Post
    I have a few questions on 3ph log splitters. At present I have a homebuilt splitter that uses a Prince HC-PTO-1AC 21 gpm PTO pump to power the splitter. The cylinder is 4"x24" with a 2" rod for about a 20-ton rating. One issue with it is that due to the size of the pump, and the fact that I don't have a cooler on it, the pump and fluid heat up fairly quickly when running the splitter. Of course, the cycle time for the splitter is measured in single-digit seconds.

    To use this splitter I obviously need to be running my tractor (a 2520). I have toyed with the idea of converting the splitter over to use tractor hydraulics. And now for my questions.

    The hydraulic gpm for the 2520 is split between the power steering (5.5 gpm), and the implements (5 gpm). If the tractor is just sitting there running, is the full 10.5 gpm available for implements, or is 5 gpm always the max, no matter what else the tractor is doing? The only way to get your 10.5 gpm is capture the oil flow before the steering valve flow divider. Not impossible, but difficult. I haven't seen or heard of it being done. Essentially you're limited to 5 gpm.

    My splitter has a control valve mounted to it right next to the cylinder. To use it, there must be full pressure available at the valve. At present my 2520 only has the standard hydraulic couplers under the right floorboards where the FEL hooks up. What do I need to get pressurized fluid to the rear of the tractor to hook up the splitter, and approximately how much does this cost? You will need to install a Power Beyond kit.

    I will admit, even though the Prince pump is capable of putting out 20+ gpm, when I ran it with my old 40U, I would run it barely above idle, so I wasn't using anywhere near the full gpm of the pump. I'm not sure how happy I would be with only 5 gpm, but if it means all I need to do is plug in two hydraulic lines, I could probably live with it. My main concern is the cost. Of course, I'm not sure how happy my 2520 PTO would be with a 50 pound Prince pump hanging off of it, and the pump technically requires 32HP for max output and pressure. Also, I need to add a cooler to my current setup, which will cost a few hundred clams, so either way I'm going to end up spending money.

    Decisions, decisions. Anyone have any input or opinions????
    You could get the PB kit and change out your cylinder for faster cycle times at the cost of lower capacity. A 3" cylinder would be a good compromise between speed and power.

    Personally I think I would stay with your current setup and figure out a cooler, if you need one. How hot does it get? Around 100 degrees above ambient would be considered normal.
    Last edited by dieselshadow; 06-17-2012 at 09:33 AM.
    - Jason

    GreenTractorTalk.com Rules, Policies, and Terms of Use

    2720 w/ 62D MMM w/independent lift, 200CX FEL, iMatch Q/H, Ballast Box, Box Blade
    , Ken's weld-on hooks, Fit Rite Hydraulics Top and Tilt kit, Artillian forks.
    1954 60 - getting mild restoration

  4. The Following User Says Thank You to dieselshadow For This Useful Post:

    andy b. (06-17-2012)

  5. Top | #3
    56FordGuy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Last Online
    Yesterday @ 09:29 PM
    Location
    Tennessee
    Posts
    2,414
    Thanks
    84
    Thanked 357 Times in 255 Posts
    A larger hydraulic tank might help with cooling.
    -Blake

    Your mileage may vary.

    '01 5320 MFWD, 541SL loader with JD Global QA

    '01 Gator 4x2.

  6. Top | #4

    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Last Online
    08-10-2014 @ 05:57 AM
    Location
    PA, USA
    Posts
    1,974
    Thanks
    435
    Thanked 169 Times in 143 Posts
    ds,

    Thanks for the info. I did some searching and it looks like the PB kit is a little over $300. I can definitely add an oil cooler to the current setup for less than that.

    The Prince pump definitely weighs 50 pounds. Do you think having that much weight on the PTO shaft for an hour or two would be of concern?

    I have a small IR temp meter so the next time I fire up the splitter I'll see what the pump temp is getting up to.

    EDIT-
    56FG,

    Yes, the Prince specs state to use a tank equal in gallons to the gpm of the pump. At present I only have a 10 gallon tank, so that is part of my problem. That is also part of my original thinking of going to a system powered by the tractor hydraulics. By the time I add a cooler and/or larger tank, I'll end up with something that needs to be mounted on a trailer and is the size of a small garden tractor. I could go with a smaller pump, but then I may as well just use the tractor hydraulics anyway.
    Andy B.

    1966 110 Lawn Tractor
    2012 2520 - DELIVERED 27APR2012!!!

    Tractor that I used to own - 1954 40 Utility
    KB3WPN

  7. Top | #5
    dieselshadow's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Last Online
    Yesterday @ 10:00 PM
    Location
    Joelton TN
    Posts
    7,243
    Thanks
    585
    Thanked 1,108 Times in 839 Posts
    Andy, I don't know how much you can safely hang off of the PTO. I'm hoping someone who does will tell us.
    - Jason

    GreenTractorTalk.com Rules, Policies, and Terms of Use

    2720 w/ 62D MMM w/independent lift, 200CX FEL, iMatch Q/H, Ballast Box, Box Blade
    , Ken's weld-on hooks, Fit Rite Hydraulics Top and Tilt kit, Artillian forks.
    1954 60 - getting mild restoration

  8. Top | #6
    Kennyd's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Last Online
    Yesterday @ 06:39 PM
    Location
    Westminster, MD
    Posts
    6,714
    Thanks
    1,091
    Thanked 953 Times in 681 Posts
    Sorry I am late to the show...but here are some of my answers for randomly picked questions/sentences:

    One issue with it is that due to the size of the pump, and the fact that I don't have a cooler on it, the pump and fluid heat up fairly quickly when running the splitter.
    First, we (you) need to define hot. It is quite normal for hydraulic fluid to be at 100* over ambient temperature, so 180*ish is fine although it fell "feel" hot.

    The hydraulic gpm for the 2520 is split between the power steering (5.5 gpm), and the implements (5 gpm). If the tractor is just sitting there running, is the full 10.5 gpm available for implements, or is 5 gpm always the max, no matter what else the tractor is doing?
    Short answer: No.

    Long answer: Your 2520 actually has two separate pumps in one housing. They both get their oil from the sump through one common line, but there are separate output's. There is no way to combine these.

    The Prince pump definitely weighs 50 pounds. Do you think having that much weight on the PTO shaft for an hour or two would be of concern?
    It's probably fine, but I would probably build a bracket to connects to the drawbar to carry some of the weight.

    My splitter has a control valve mounted to it right next to the cylinder. To use it, there must be full pressure available at the valve. At present my 2520 only has the standard hydraulic couplers under the right floorboards where the FEL hooks up. What do I need to get pressurized fluid to the rear of the tractor to hook up the splitter, and approximately how much does this cost?
    You could simply use two long extension hoses from the mid-SCV and use a bungee cord to hold the joystick over left or all the way up. But that will cost $100 or more just to find out it's a ll to slow anyway.


    I would:
    -Get real numbers for the temperature so we know if the is a real problem.
    -Keep the PTO pump, its the best way to power a logsplitter from a small tractor. Build a bracket for it like I wrote above.
    -Look at this calculator: [url=http://www.baumhydraulics.com/calculators/cyl_speed.htm]Hydraulic Cylinder
    -John Deere 4110HST
    FEL, MMM, Artillian 42" Forks, I-Match, Ballast Box, #380 plow (modified to fit), Markham LD-48 Grapple, Trac-Vac 854 and lots of other STUFF.
    -John Deere 455 AWS w/60" MMM
    -John Deere 4x2 Turf Gator

    View some of my projects/adventures in my Picasa Album

    Simple JDParts Tutorial HERE

    Bolt on Grab Hooks are now for sale!!

    Visit our YouTube Channel

  9. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Kennyd For This Useful Post:

    andy b. (06-17-2012), robpm (06-20-2012)

  10. Top | #7
    dieselshadow's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Last Online
    Yesterday @ 10:00 PM
    Location
    Joelton TN
    Posts
    7,243
    Thanks
    585
    Thanked 1,108 Times in 839 Posts
    Thanks for correcting me on the hydraulic pump scenario Kenny. That would explain why I never heard of someone doing it.
    - Jason

    GreenTractorTalk.com Rules, Policies, and Terms of Use

    2720 w/ 62D MMM w/independent lift, 200CX FEL, iMatch Q/H, Ballast Box, Box Blade
    , Ken's weld-on hooks, Fit Rite Hydraulics Top and Tilt kit, Artillian forks.
    1954 60 - getting mild restoration

  11. Top | #8
    Mdufresne's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Last Online
    08-14-2014 @ 09:17 PM
    Location
    Bow, NH
    Posts
    89
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 9 Times in 9 Posts
    I am in the process of setting up a Tractor Supply model splitter that I will be using the PB that I had installed when I bought my rig. The TS splitter has a 4" x 24" and haven't read about any overheating problems.

    I didn't want the cheap cradle they have and I always use a splitter in the vertical position so I scratched it and made my own. Just waiting for some quick connect couplers from Grainger.

    Converting a 3PH log splitter to run off of tractor hydraulics-photo-38-.jpg
    2011 2720 - 62D MMM - SB1154 Rear Blower - BB2060 Box Blade - 647 Tiller - iMatch - HLA Pallet Forks - County Line 4' Brush Hog - 5' Landscape Rake - Carry All - Sub Soiler - Spreader - Power Flow MCS

  12. Top | #9
    Kennyd's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Last Online
    Yesterday @ 06:39 PM
    Location
    Westminster, MD
    Posts
    6,714
    Thanks
    1,091
    Thanked 953 Times in 681 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by Mdufresne View Post
    The TS splitter has a 4" x 24" and haven't read about any overheating problems.
    Overheating won't be a problem, but speed may be.

    According to the calculator I linked above:

    Extend Time= 16 sec. Retract Time= 9.6 sec. Cycle Time= 25.6 sec.
    -John Deere 4110HST
    FEL, MMM, Artillian 42" Forks, I-Match, Ballast Box, #380 plow (modified to fit), Markham LD-48 Grapple, Trac-Vac 854 and lots of other STUFF.
    -John Deere 455 AWS w/60" MMM
    -John Deere 4x2 Turf Gator

    View some of my projects/adventures in my Picasa Album

    Simple JDParts Tutorial HERE

    Bolt on Grab Hooks are now for sale!!

    Visit our YouTube Channel

  13. Top | #10
    Mdufresne's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Last Online
    08-14-2014 @ 09:17 PM
    Location
    Bow, NH
    Posts
    89
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 9 Times in 9 Posts
    I'm old........the longer the cycle time means I have more time to grab the next log.
    2011 2720 - 62D MMM - SB1154 Rear Blower - BB2060 Box Blade - 647 Tiller - iMatch - HLA Pallet Forks - County Line 4' Brush Hog - 5' Landscape Rake - Carry All - Sub Soiler - Spreader - Power Flow MCS

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Converting a 3v garage door remote to operate on the tractors 12v system
    By Ericfap in forum Sub Compact Utility Tractors (SCUT)
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 05-25-2012, 02:57 PM
  2. Log Splitter for 2305 3-point hitch
    By Western MD Green Machine in forum Sub Compact Utility Tractors (SCUT)
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 12-06-2011, 06:30 AM
  3. 5103 Power Beyond for log splitter ?
    By fidlinrnd in forum Utility Tractors
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: 11-20-2011, 07:31 AM
  4. '73 410 , slow loader bucket hydraulics, weak hoe hydraulics
    By daywelding in forum Construction Equipment
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 09-01-2011, 10:06 PM
  5. Log Splitter
    By BigDogTrain in forum Hydraulics
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: 01-25-2011, 09:31 AM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •