rebuilding old 15'x50' barn - a few questions
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    Question rebuilding old 15'x50' barn - a few questions

    In my backyard there is an old bank barn of sorts. The top story is 50' long and 15' wide. The bottom story is about 35' long and 15' wide, so part of the second story is on the top of a hill and has a crushed stone floor. I plan to store my garden tractor and a few other outdoor tools on the stone floor side of the second story, since my garden is located right next to it. I plan to put my woodworking equipment (tablesaw, bandsaw, molder, workbench, etc.) on the wooden floor of the second story.

    I have most of what I'm going to do figured out, but I'm not sure what to do with the floor of the second story. It is just wide enough that I think I either need to go with 2x12 floor joists, or if I go to 10x2 I think I would need a center beam under the joists, and then of course some sort of posts every few feet to support the beam, which I want to try and avoid. I am planning on putting the joists on 16" centers, but would go to 12" if it changes anything. I plan to use 2x6 tongue and groove as the flooring on the second story.

    So what do you guys think, will 2x12 span the 15' with no problems, or should I use a center beam, or could I even go with 2x10 and span the 15'? If I need to use a center beam, can I just go with 2x8 for the joists? I would prefer to avoid the hassle of the center beam and posts, and I don't want to go with the engineered I-beams for the joists as I'm attempting to keep the costs down. Although, I have no idea how much engineered 15' I-beams go for.
    Andy B.

    1966 110 Lawn Tractor
    2012 2520 - DELIVERED 27APR2012!!!

    Tractor that I used to own - 1954 40 Utility
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    Brian's Avatar
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    How much weight do you want to put on the second floor and can you post pictures of this so we get a better idea?



    Brian

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    As much weight as I can.

    Just kidding.
    The tablesaw isn't too big, maybe 200 lbs.
    The bandsaw is about 470 lbs.
    Moulder/shaper maybe 350.
    Jointer around 300
    Delta belt/disk sander around 250
    roll-around toolbox maybe 300
    Then I want a workbench along one long wall (maybe 25' of it)
    Plus various sawhorses, and some shelves long the other wall.
    All of the bigger tools are on roll-around bases, so they would generally be along walls, and not all sitting next to each other in the center of the floor.

    Here are a few pics. The floor on the second story was always a little scary, and I never even used it for anything. The roof fell in about 16 months ago, and I figure I better do something with it or else I'll be demolishing the entire thing. As it is, the foundation is still solid, and I plan to just get rid of everything else and start over. I have a lot of stuff laying around to rebuild it, but I don't have the floor joists, so I would need to buy whatever it is I went with.

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    Last edited by andy b.; 05-26-2013 at 09:37 AM.
    Andy B.

    1966 110 Lawn Tractor
    2012 2520 - DELIVERED 27APR2012!!!

    Tractor that I used to own - 1954 40 Utility
    KB3WPN

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    Uncle Wayne's Avatar
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    Andy,

    I have a pool table that weighs 2500 lbs. on a crawlspace that the carpenters figured out would need double 2 x 16's to support the table and people walking around without the floor giving. They supported the 2 x 16's with 12" concrete blocks laid on a concrete footing. That is just under the area around the 8' pool table. I don't know if you'll be able to get by without the beams and support.

    My table and floor is very steady. The work was done in 1994 and the table is still level. Good luck with your project.
    Wayne
    2013 JD 4520 CUT with 400X FEL
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    Yeah, the more I think about it, the more I think I might run a center beam. The good thing would be, the floor would then be strong enough that if I ever wanted to move a garden tractor in there to do something like an oil change or swap tires around or something, the floor would hold it. Plus, the bottom story would be mostly storage except for the front portion which might end up with a gas grill for outdoor cooking, so a few posts and a beam aren't going to really cause me any trouble.

    The last thing I need is a bandsaw falling through the floor.
    Andy B.

    1966 110 Lawn Tractor
    2012 2520 - DELIVERED 27APR2012!!!

    Tractor that I used to own - 1954 40 Utility
    KB3WPN

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    mjncad's Avatar
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    You're a braver man than me Andy. Call me chicken; but I'd have a structural engineer look over the building and your ideas for it. I see a lot of things that could go horribly wrong or get very expensive very quickly. An engineer's recommendations will be cheap compared to a catastrophic failure.

    I don't think the engineered wood I-beam joists are that terribly expensive; otherwise cheap ass home builders wouldn't use them. Besides I'd rather work with a straight joist instead of the dimensional pretzel wood lumber that is common now-a-days.

    Remember, in general remodeling is always more expensive than new on a per square foot basis.

    Quote Originally Posted by Uncle Wayne View Post
    Andy,

    I have a pool table that weighs 2500 lbs. on a crawlspace that the carpenters figured out would need double 2 x 16's to support the table and people walking around without the floor giving. They supported the 2 x 16's with 12" concrete blocks laid on a concrete footing. That is just under the area around the 8' pool table. I don't know if you'll be able to get by without the beams and support.

    My table and floor is very steady. The work was done in 1994 and the table is still level. Good luck with your project.
    Good lord Wayne, is that table made out of granite?
    I have more ideas than ambition.


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    Uncle Wayne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mjncad View Post
    Good lord Wayne, is that table made out of granite?
    Ha, it cost like it was granite! My bad, (big fingers = sloppy typing), should have been 1500 lbs. (actually 1488 according to my spec sheet.)
    Wayne
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    Quote Originally Posted by mjncad View Post
    You're a braver man than me Andy. Call me chicken; but I'd have a structural engineer look over the building and your ideas for it. I see a lot of things that could go horribly wrong or get very expensive very quickly. An engineer's recommendations will be cheap compared to a catastrophic failure.

    I don't think the engineered wood I-beam joists are that terribly expensive; otherwise cheap ass home builders wouldn't use them. Besides I'd rather work with a straight joist instead of the dimensional pretzel wood lumber that is common now-a-days.

    Remember, in general remodeling is always more expensive than new on a per square foot basis.
    I'm not sure you get the full measure of my "remodeling" plan. All I plan to keep is the concrete foundation and a few steel posts that support the second story. It will basically be new construction. The photos mainly show the overall size, and how it sets into the bank.

    Maybe I will check the I-beams out. They make one style right up the road from me, so maybe they are cheaper than I thought.
    Andy B.

    1966 110 Lawn Tractor
    2012 2520 - DELIVERED 27APR2012!!!

    Tractor that I used to own - 1954 40 Utility
    KB3WPN

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    Keeper of the GTT Cookies dieselshadow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by andy b. View Post
    I'm not sure you get the full measure of my "remodeling" plan. All I plan to keep is the concrete foundation and a few steel posts that support the second story. It will basically be new construction. The photos mainly show the overall size, and how it sets into the bank.

    Maybe I will check the I-beams out. They make one style right up the road from me, so maybe they are cheaper than I thought.
    Whew... I thought you were "remodeling" and using the existing structure as well. You know, just reinforcing what's there. That would've been awfully ambitious.
    - Jason

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    Jason,

    I'm crazy, but not that crazy!
    You would have liked when I built my polebarn. There were two connected old sheds and I wanted to build the polebarn where the sheds were, only larger. I built then entire polebarn except for the last for or five roof trusses over/around the old sheds. We used the old sheds as scaffolding to walk on the roofs to make it easier to set the trusses. After cutting a chunk of the shed roofs off, we set the last trusses, and then I smashed the old sheds with my old OC-46 track loader and hauled them out of the polebarn. I'm sure people driving by wondered what the heck I was doing, and my dad thought I was crazy, until he got to walk on the old sheds to help set the trusses with me. He thought it was a good idea after that.
    dieselshadow likes this.
    Andy B.

    1966 110 Lawn Tractor
    2012 2520 - DELIVERED 27APR2012!!!

    Tractor that I used to own - 1954 40 Utility
    KB3WPN

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