coalminer16's G puller
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Thread: coalminer16's G puller

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    tlock0331's Avatar
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    coalminer16's G puller

    You are right, lets not high jack a thread....so....you said

    "Not trying to high jack the thread. 900 cubic inch. I remember the stroke was 10 1/8 inches to where we had to shave the tranny gears to clear. I forgot the piston diameter but the sleaves where actually bored outside of the block. We couldn't use the two outside block bolts from that. Had to notch the left piston to clear the cam gear and notch both pistons to clear the rod throw. The cam was pretty thin too from the rods/crank going by it.we cut about 2500 lbs off as well. I blew the block out the front of the tractor. He could pull the sled at 25 MPH in 4th gear. Mine was closer to 150 hp. He was 1st and I was typically 3rd. An Oliver or Moline would be 2nd. My tractor never blew up and his did twice. His took 3.5 gall of high octane race fuel in the distance of the pull. Often my father would be at the end of the track with more fuel to get it back to the trailer. That was close to 20 years ago now. Lot of money for no return other then fun."

    Okay, so my math may be a bit fuzzy, but at 10 1/8th stroke that puts your bore around 10.64, putting you at 900.26 ci. that being said, you would have 125 hp per hole. some of the best G pullers i have seen were only around 100 hp running 700ci. The frame isnt hardly over 20" wide, let alone the head itself. so how were you sealing the compression? assuming you were using a later model G, the base weight was somewhere around 7500 lbs, and you stripped 2500 lbs off of it? How did you manage to put that much HP to the ground running in a 5000 lbs class? How were you getting that much fuel through the carb? what sort of wheel tire combo was on that?

    How did you never blow your tractor up, but you blew the block out of the front of the tractor?

    Im trying to keep up here so those are just a few of my questions to help me wrap my head around that
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    JD322's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tlock0331 View Post

    Okay, so my math may be a bit fuzzy, but at 10 1/8th stroke that puts your bore around 10.64, putting you at 900.26 ci. that being said, you would have 125 hp per hole. some of the best G pullers i have seen were only around 100 hp running 700ci. The frame isnt hardly over 20" wide, let alone the head itself. so how were you sealing the compression? assuming you were using a later model G, the base weight was somewhere around 7500 lbs, and you stripped 2500 lbs off of it? How did you manage to put that much HP to the ground running in a 5000 lbs class? How were you getting that much fuel through the carb? what sort of wheel tire combo was on that?

    How did you never blow your tractor up, but you blew the block out of the front of the tractor?

    Im trying to keep up here so those are just a few of my questions to help me wrap my head around that
    Not trying to steal coalminer16's thunder by any means, just a fellow enthusiast...

    By the math, it would have put his bore at approximately 7.52"

    Volume of a Cylinder 450 CI
    Height of Cylinder (stroke) 10.125"
    Radius 3.76"

    This is almost typical in the Big G's on the antique pulling circuit today some of them are pushing 1000 cubes. Here is an example of a performance block that actually exceeds the bore that coalminer's was at 7.75":
    JOHN DEERE Power Blocks, Heads, Blocks Heads and Manifolds for Styled and Un-Styled A & G Antique Tractors

    It sounds as though coalminer and crew were innovators in the field 20 years ago!

    They even call out: NOTES! Crankcase modification required for installation!!!!

    The sleeve of the block actually pokes through the case just in front of the belt pulley, you have to grind that radius out of the side of the case and then weld a patch on the outside in order to accommodate the sleeve for clearance and to hold the oil in. As well as all of the other machining and modifications he described. Of course, the flow of from one's wallet doesn't just stop at the block; stroker crank (welded or billet steel), performance head, manifold, worked up carb, cam, ect...

    Going to the extreme requires reinforcement add on's to tie the block back to the transmission to keep the weakened case from blowing up as would be my guess from his description... there was a video floating around of a catastrophic failure of this from a couple of summers ago, a Big G without the reinforcement let go coming down the track, basically snapped in half... pretty ugly.

    As far as shaving weight, everything that isn't necessary for the function of pulling a sled down the track is stripped from the tractor. When you take them this far, they no longer go for a putt around the farm, pull a hay wagon or drive down main street on parade day.

    It is 100% possible to weigh in under 5000# with the driver (bare) as in no movable weight.

    Most guys pulling this caliber of tractor run 18.4 - 38 full cut tires on tin or aluminium rims with weld on hubs to get the HP to the ground, balancing the tractor with movable weight and tire pressure is a lot of it, being a good driver and knowing your tractor doesn't hurt either...

    For the purist collector type, I'm sure that shivers run up their spines at the thought of what is done to bones of some of these pulling tractors. On the flip side there are some really talented individuals out there with incredible skill sets wringing horsepower out of 65 to 80 year old tractors that the engineers at Deere most likely never dreamed possible in the day.
    dieselshadow likes this.
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    tlock0331's Avatar
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    i will quote myself when i said my math may be a bit fuzzy....i forgot to cut the 900 ci in half - DUH! my numbers would produce 900 ci per hole HAHAH so yea, i missed that one when i ran that through my head 17 times - i couldnt see the forest because of the trees. given that i forgot to cut the 900 in half then a LOT more of it makes sense. I have been around pullers and hot rods, everything from lawn mowers to mini rods, motorcycles, trucks and tractors, gas or diesel never mattered, my whole life so as far as building a puller that is nothing new, but when i tried forcing 900 ci into one hole, that was a bit of a game changer. Aside from that, i would also think you would have to all but pour gas down its throat haha

    I knew an older man in witchita ks that was big in pullers, he used to cast his own blocks, heads, and whatnot. he would save all the aluminum heads he could get his hands on to cast everything, was awesome.
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    coalminer16's Avatar
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    The 7.5 inches sounds right. There were two tractors. Mine the Grave Digger did NOT blow up. The Grim Ripper my brothers tractor did blow up two times.

    Some of the rules for our class of pulling - you had to remain in the same shell of the the tractor. You couldn't use block spacers which would have decreased the rod angle and helped a lot. At the time 10 inch stroke was max but my brother liked to push things so he took it 1/8 inch further. That was what made his the biggest.

    Honestly at the county fair where we were showing both tractors for 4H they also had a pull. The chains got under the wheely bars and when he took off they threw him up and his had slipped off the throttle. With a dead man's throttle it killed the tractor. That is a bad thing on a high compression engine. We finished the show and pull. Washing it it blew with a hole on the underside. He won a trip to the state Fair as did I in a separate class (shop vs self determined ). I pulled his in and out of the mn state Fair. They had to be drained of fuel to he showed in the building. That was our b excuse. No one noticed the hole on the bottom of the engine block. Granted it was painted black so it blended in. We both won our class.

    Took a fuel pump and a big nut carb bored to the max to flow the fuel and air needed.

    With hp even the cooling fan was around 5 hp that it took to run. We had an electronic fan. No charging system. Electrical water pump. The top engine cover had two channel iron aluminum tops to get the crank throw.

    Weight wise. We lathes the rear bull gears, which only a 38 G had soft enough gears to do without breaking the bit. Lathes the gear reduction after the clutch. We had to for the piston clearance cut the cam gear in 1/2 width wise. The axles were lathes and cut short. The rim disks on mine were custom thin tin. Brother trimmed his our in tear drop shapes. Tires were 18.4 with two sizes too small tubes saving 40 lbs but getting them to air up blew a few tubes as they tore and blew. The back bull gear cover my brother took welding class in high school. They had a plastic welder. So I got a white plastic 3 lbs cover vs the 350 lbs hydro back unit before similar to the early tractors as far as the rounded look. He went smoked glass see threw plastic so you could see the gears moving. Seat was aluminum as well. Frame rails cut down. Front steering made from JD 45 loader hyd rams bolted onto a different front end that was also cut down. The frame cut didn't help my brother as he lost the two bottom frame holes to bolt the block down and then the cylinder sleaves were so big he had to size down two more holes on the side. Radiator was a much smaller aluminum from the junk yard. It would over heat pretty fast. Fuel tank was aluminum on the front weight bracket so that saved as well. Trailer tires that were smaller up front.

    Adjustable hitch so it met height even if lowering the air pressure in the rear tires.

    We did this before we could legally drive. Father was into showing beef cows and we weren't. He doesn't to this day understand what the heck we do in the shop. He just supports us vs making us to beef cattle.

    The tractors had so much compression that we had oversized pet cocks we had to open to start. When we turned the ignition off it would continue to run via dieseling to ignite the fuel.

    We did also run smaller but stronger starters. I can't remember if it was a 4020 starter or a larger Bobcat starter in the 800 series. Maybe we had one of each. That also saved weight.

    Hope that helps answer some questions. Been a few years. Brother is looking to someday put a diesel in his next. He knows how but time money and having kids changes a lot. We were single in high school when we did these before.

    Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk
    JD322 likes this.
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    coalminer16's Avatar
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    Also we do did almost play with 5-6 gear to get custom gearing at the end. Even had the gears but never installed.

    Brothers tractor was made out of 7 parts GM tractors that otherwise had no hope of running ever again. Mine could still be put to stock. And of you saw our collection you would understand. I have attached only ola couple out of many. Fyi we do show to who ever is interested. Central mn

    Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk
    "Travis" on WFM
    First year 332 with H3 added X 2, JD 3 pt, JD factory delux seat with flip pan. 430 rear diff. 430 fender deck(have two that are mirror copies of themselves). 420, two more 332's.
    Attachments:JD 44 loader, JD 50 inch mowing deck, JD 48 replacement mowing deck JD 47 two stage snow blower, JD Hyd 42 Tiller, Gannon Earthcavator 42 inch 3 point mount, Cozy cab, JD 20 plow, Brinly 12 inch plow.

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    JD322 (11-28-2017)

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