Family Pond Boils at Center of a ‘Regulatory War’ in Wyoming
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Thread: Family Pond Boils at Center of a ‘Regulatory War’ in Wyoming

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    Family Pond Boils at Center of a ‘Regulatory War’ in Wyoming

    Family PondBoils at Center of a ‘Regulatory War’ in Wyoming
    http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/19/us/regulatory-war-fought-over-a-wyoming-familys-pond.html?emc=edit_th_20150919&nl=todaysheadlines& nlid=49583666&_r=0

    FortBridger, Wyoming
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fort_Bridger,_Wyoming

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    The EPA thugs are at it again; yet they can pollute the Animas River and essentially get away with it. Fort Bridger is literally in the middle of nowhere with a population of 345. I hope this guy wins his case.
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    Unbelievable!! I sincerely hope that the gentleman and his family are able to persevere.

    I don't remember the specifics, but I remember reading something about people in either Washington or Oregon being hassled by the EPA for having rain barrels connected to their downspouts. Some kind of crap about any water that falls from the sky belongs to the public and that by "diverting" the water, they are encroaching on public waterways. Basically what the EPA is trying to do is say that anything from a thimbleful on up is a public water way. This whole thing is getting entirely out of hand.
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    Wotus

    EPA has basically declared most of the country as "Waters of the US" by issuing a regulation. The US House of Representatives has passed a bill to return to the old definition. The Senate has not acted on a similar bill SB1140. Please ask your Senator to support SB1140 and end this nonsense.

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    Hey, I want a title too! ZachinCO's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mark02tj View Post
    Unbelievable!! I sincerely hope that the gentleman and his family are able to persevere.

    I don't remember the specifics, but I remember reading something about people in either Washington or Oregon being hassled by the EPA for having rain barrels connected to their downspouts. Some kind of crap about any water that falls from the sky belongs to the public and that by "diverting" the water, they are encroaching on public waterways. Basically what the EPA is trying to do is say that anything from a thimbleful on up is a public water way. This whole thing is getting entirely out of hand.
    Rain barrels are "illegal" here in CO too. Pretty pathetic the overreach by the FEDS.

    It amazes me that there are several folks in outdoors/hunting community that feel the public is better served by having the FEDS control public lands vs state control.
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    The EPA is heavily staffed with Envirowackos, and extremely hard left Globalists.
    Overreach, is their std., and intimidation though extreme fines, and asset seizures has been their normal for years now.

    Just recently, a neighbor spent 3 years fighting them, despite having all the permits and approvals from the state.
    It was ridiculous, cost him over a Million, and got the state embroiled in a huge legal battle, that still isn't over.
    In the process, the EPA issued a "Stop work" order, unless it was restoration, and required permits for the restoration...which left 160 Acres of ground bare going into winter, and flooding in the spring. They would not allow a cover crop, or any sort of runoff abatement to be done, while things were tied up in court.
    Of course the obvious occured, and LOTS of topsoil went down stream, which led to more fines.

    Now with the WOTUS rule, all of us Farmbillys are staring down a giant mountain of red tape, and permitting, just to repair a clogged drain tile, that is flooding a field. The EPA gets 30 days to respond. Orchard Trees and Bushed start dying within 3 days.
    Worse, the EPA now requires individual permits for applications of Fertilizer, herbicides, insecticides, despite the States already having a much less onerous regulatory mechanisms in place, in ADDITION to FIFRA that already covers what is and isn't allowed in each state, by product labels being the law.

    I feel bad for that family. The EPA WILL send a swat team out to evict them, seize everything he owns, and then charge them as criminals, as they see fit. Due process does not apply to bureaucrats, and forget about the Bill of rights.
    I hope the state steps in, and steps in hard on their behalf.

    As it is, the Law suit filed in North Dakota to stop the WOTUS ruling, only put things on hold for the states that signed on, and I read today that the EPA is choosing to enforce that authority, in all states that did not.

    Folks need to consider how close their houses are, to any body of water, creek, or seasonal mud puddle.
    That fall application of weed N' Feed to the lawn, is very likely to require a Permit, before the application, and tilling up the low spot for a Garden, might just get you in deep doodoo.

    I'm wondering how bad the big citys are going to get clobbered for their storm drain systems, and the billions of gallons of nasty junk that runs off the streets, yards, and roads.
    I really don't think any of the mega citys can afford to completely revamp their storm water systems, and even fewer small towns can.
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    mjncad's Avatar
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    I don't know about Washington and Oregon; but Zach is right that it's illegal in Banorado to have a rain barrel as the state considers all precipitation to be their property. Yet, my worthless Demorrhoid run county has illegally taxed (via fee) unincorporated property owners in the western half of the county for stormwater that falls on impervious portions (e.g. roofs, concrete and asphalt drives and sidewalks) of one's property. You heard it right, property owners are taxed on state property and the GOP appointed pinhead judge upheld the county's right to do so.

    Water in the west is a scarce resource compared to the east, and water law is extremely convoluted; but come on, screwing the Wyoming man over his pond, banning rain barrels, and taxing stormwater. So much for the USA being the land of the free.

    By the way, I had to look up WOTUS as trying to keep up with all the Gummint's alphabet agencies and acronyms is a chore to put it politely. WOTUS = Waters Of The United States.

    Quote Originally Posted by mark02tj View Post
    Unbelievable!! I sincerely hope that the gentleman and his family are able to persevere.

    I don't remember the specifics, but I remember reading something about people in either Washington or Oregon being hassled by the EPA for having rain barrels connected to their downspouts. Some kind of crap about any water that falls from the sky belongs to the public and that by "diverting" the water, they are encroaching on public waterways. Basically what the EPA is trying to do is say that anything from a thimbleful on up is a public water way. This whole thing is getting entirely out of hand.
    Quote Originally Posted by ZachinCO View Post
    Rain barrels are "illegal" here in CO too. Pretty pathetic the overreach by the FEDS.

    It amazes me that there are several folks in outdoors/hunting community that feel the public is better served by having the FEDS control public lands vs state control.
    I have more ideas than ambition.


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    Damming up a creek or river to hold back water has been a big no no since the wild west days. Your blocking the flow of water to those down stream. This one could go either way. I don't think any of you would be happy if you had your creek dry up because someone up stream put in a dam to create a pond for themselves.
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    Interesting question

    Quote Originally Posted by ejb69 View Post
    Damming up a creek or river to hold back water has been a big no no since the wild west days. Your blocking the flow of water to those down stream. This one could go either way. I don't think any of you would be happy if you had your creek dry up because someone up stream put in a dam to create a pond for themselves.
    I wouldn't mind if there was a dam upstream as it might catch silt, even out the flow etc. If the upstream user dried up the stream by withdrawing too much water, I would have an issue but in this case it seems their withdrawal didn't change. However, the real no no is doing anything without asking EPA, "Mother, May I?" Unfortunately the EPA modus operandi is to find one person and attempt to hang them in order to scare everyone else. Since they have virtually unlimited funds for legal costs, it doesn't really matter if they win or lose. The outcome is the same as they will bankrupt families, businesses etc. even those who ultimately "win" a court case.

    It's not so much about protecting the environment as it is about protecting the power of those at the EPA. The only solution is for Congress to tell them to read and follow the constitution and to cut the budget enough so that only the real issues are addressed.

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    The EPA and the US Fish and Wildlife Department are both out of control.

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