X749 Diesel Shuts Off After 20 Minutes
Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 16
Like Tree9Likes

Thread: X749 Diesel Shuts Off After 20 Minutes

  1. Top | #1

    Join Date
    May 2018
    Last Online
    07-13-2018 @ 09:16 AM
    Location
    West Virginia
    Posts
    1
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    X749 Diesel Shuts Off After 20 Minutes

    I've owned the tractor since new 2008 model X749. 550 Hours. I mow 3 acres with lots of WV hills. I get it serviced every year by the dealer. It started last year, after an hour it would sputter and die. It has gotten worse and is now down to 20 minutes. It feels like someone cuts off the fuel. Once it dies it does not want to start until you let it cool down. Cooling the engine, pumps, hoses, and components with fine water spray for a couple minutes will buy me another 10-20 minutes of run time so I think its external to the engine. It dies more going down hill then up hill. Once it dies going down hill I can restart it and mow uphill (forward/reverse/repeat) for another 5 minutes but it will die going up hill when it gets hotter. It doesn't matter if its 85 or 60 deg outside, I get 20 minutes of run time. The engine temp is quite different and the other morning wasn't even half way on the gauge. heat gun shows injector pump shuts off the first time at 175 deg, with the 3 injector supply lines at 180. After cooling with garden hose the injector pump shuts down the 2nd and 3rd time at 150 to 160 with supply lines at 165. So I don't think its injector pump. The fact the cool water immediately fixes the problem makes me think its not the injectors themselves.

    I've replaced the filter and fuel solenoid.
    Checked all hose connections.
    I added a 12v pump between the tank and lift pump to make sure I was getting positive fuel pressure to the injector pump and not having any leaks.
    I tightened the screws on the lift pump housing (got 1/4 turn on each of them)
    I've topped off the tank to make sure the supply line inside was not getting air.

    I have ordered and will be replacing the following:
    Fuel bowl and o-ring
    All 3 braided hoses
    Lift Pump


    I've read a lot of posts about this tractor dying and a lot of suggestions. However none of them with my symptoms.
    1. It happens when one of the external components gets hot
    2. It shuts off downhill at a lower temp then up hill
    3. fine mist cooling of components resets it.


    Do I need to:
    Replace Battery?
    Remove fuel Solenoid and put in a manual fuel valve?

    When I changed out the solenoid for the first time, I got an hour and thought I had it fixed, but it went right back to what it was doing. Do I have a bad battery and did it burn up my new solenoid?

    Thank you!!

  2. Remove Advertisements
    GreenTractorTalk.com
    Advertisements
     

  3. Top | #2
    arlen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Last Online
    Today @ 02:55 PM
    Location
    South East Minnesota
    Posts
    3,145
    Thanks
    334
    Thanked 416 Times in 314 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by Jason W View Post
    I've owned the tractor since new 2008 model X749. 550 Hours. I mow 3 acres with lots of WV hills. I get it serviced every year by the dealer. It started last year, after an hour it would sputter and die. It has gotten worse and is now down to 20 minutes. It feels like someone cuts off the fuel. Once it dies it does not want to start until you let it cool down. Cooling the engine, pumps, hoses, and components with fine water spray for a couple minutes will buy me another 10-20 minutes of run time so I think its external to the engine. It dies more going down hill then up hill. Once it dies going down hill I can restart it and mow uphill (forward/reverse/repeat) for another 5 minutes but it will die going up hill when it gets hotter. It doesn't matter if its 85 or 60 deg outside, I get 20 minutes of run time. The engine temp is quite different and the other morning wasn't even half way on the gauge. heat gun shows injector pump shuts off the first time at 175 deg, with the 3 injector supply lines at 180. After cooling with garden hose the injector pump shuts down the 2nd and 3rd time at 150 to 160 with supply lines at 165. So I don't think its injector pump. The fact the cool water immediately fixes the problem makes me think its not the injectors themselves.

    I've replaced the filter and fuel solenoid.
    Checked all hose connections.
    I added a 12v pump between the tank and lift pump to make sure I was getting positive fuel pressure to the injector pump and not having any leaks.
    I tightened the screws on the lift pump housing (got 1/4 turn on each of them)
    I've topped off the tank to make sure the supply line inside was not getting air.

    I have ordered and will be replacing the following:
    Fuel bowl and o-ring
    All 3 braided hoses
    Lift Pump


    I've read a lot of posts about this tractor dying and a lot of suggestions. However none of them with my symptoms.
    1. It happens when one of the external components gets hot
    2. It shuts off downhill at a lower temp then up hill
    3. fine mist cooling of components resets it.


    Do I need to:
    Replace Battery?
    Remove fuel Solenoid and put in a manual fuel valve?

    When I changed out the solenoid for the first time, I got an hour and thought I had it fixed, but it went right back to what it was doing. Do I have a bad battery and did it burn up my new solenoid?

    Thank you!!
    Maybe your fuel cap isn’t venting properly. Otherwise, you could have a gunked up fuel line or tank. I don’t think it’s your solenoid (yet).
    Last edited by arlen; 06-01-2018 at 06:08 AM.
    Jason W likes this.
    4720 66hp Open Station, Power Beyond, 3rd, 4th and 5th Rear SCV, iMatch, 400cx with SSQA, 3rd Loader Function, MX6, BoDozer Grapple
    JD 320D Skid Loader
    Gator 865r...Fully Pimped Out

    X748SE 24hp, 647 Tiller, 54" front blade, 47 Snow Blower, 62C deck, JD disk

    JD 997 Zero Turn

    Farmall B

    2 miniature donkeys, 1/8 hp (each)

  4. Top | #3

    Join Date
    Dec 2017
    Last Online
    Today @ 02:16 PM
    Location
    Athens, TN
    Posts
    363
    Thanks
    28
    Thanked 83 Times in 67 Posts
    Jason, I'm totally unfamiliar with your tractor, but only one thing stops a diesel engine: no fuel. Do you have a wiring diagram? Is there a temp or oil switch that is wired in series with fuel solenoid? Checking coolant level or blowing out engine tins may help. Sorry I can't be more specific, Bob
    Ray_PA and Jason W like this.

  5. Remove Advertisements
    GreenTractorTalk.com
    Advertisements
     

  6. Top | #4
    SulleyBear's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Last Online
    Today @ 05:26 PM
    Location
    Beautiful beaches, moderated summer heat and lake effect snows. Right where I want to be.
    Posts
    6,998
    Thanks
    1,413
    Thanked 2,493 Times in 1,402 Posts
    Jason,

    Generally, the fuel solenoids fail and they won't allow fuel flow for the tractor to start. I have seen situations where they refuse to hold open the fuel shutoff, but it's usually failing and not allowing the tractor to start.

    Can you manually move the fuel solenoid once the tractor stops to see if it will restart? I know it's more of an enclosed type of solenoid than the machines before it. Even if there is a way to reach in and pull the solenoid with piece of wire, just to see if you can "over ride" it.

    Heat related issues are often tied to bad grounds. I would check the main battery ground cable (pull the cable off the battery end and CLEAN IT with a wire terminal cleaner) and I would also check the cable for any damage. Check the ground bolt and make sure it is tight.

    What voltage does your battery show? If it's 12.5 volts or more, the battery is likely fine. But depending upon it's age, it should certainly be load tested. I highly doubt it's the battery......

    Please explain how you added the 12 volt "pump" into your fuel system. Was it a test only addition or did you leave it? Did you pull the mechanical fuel pump off the Injector pump and check it to make sure its clean and functioning properly?

    The fact that it's so predictable in it's stopping, with 20 minutes, makes me think it's possibly electrical. Have you replaced the fuses, even if they show OK? I would as they are cheap and it's easy. Make sure to clean the fuse terminal very good with compressed air and some electrical contact cleaner.

    I need to read your post again before I post more....................
    Tomfive and Jason W like this.

    1025R with Mauser Cab
    (10/2017)/ 120R FEL / RC2048 Mower / All of Ken's Bolt on Products / 60" HD Front Broom / 3 pt 45 Gallon Boom less Sprayer / CA2068 Core Aerator / I-Match / 54" Snow Plow w/ angling Quick Attach / Frontier 3 Pt Sprayer / Pallet Forks / 8 -42# Weights

    John Deere 455 (New in 9/1996) / MC519 Cart /60" MMM /47" Snow Thrower / 7'3" snow plow / Quick Hitch /
    4 -42# Weights / JD#10 Cart

    ExMark Lazer Z w/60" Deck , Billy Goat Blower , Full Stable of Echo Products





  7. Top | #5
    coaltrain's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Last Online
    Today @ 04:57 PM
    Location
    NW Penna
    Posts
    19,803
    Thanks
    1,058
    Thanked 3,061 Times in 2,226 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by arlen View Post
    Maybe your fuel cap isnít venting properly. Otherwise, you could have a gunked up fuel line or tank. I donít think itís your solenoid (yet).
    I would start there also. Run it with the fuel cap loose to see if it still does it. If that doesnít help I would clean the fuel tank out and be sure the pickup is clean/not clogged. Donít know if there is a strainer on the fuel line in the tank.
    Jason W likes this.
    ~Stan~
    It is what it is
    Knowledge is power, ignorance is bliss
    2520 w/200CX w/62D2

  8. Top | #6
    SulleyBear's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Last Online
    Today @ 05:26 PM
    Location
    Beautiful beaches, moderated summer heat and lake effect snows. Right where I want to be.
    Posts
    6,998
    Thanks
    1,413
    Thanked 2,493 Times in 1,402 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by Jason W View Post
    I've owned the tractor since new 2008 model X749. 550 Hours. I mow 3 acres with lots of WV hills. I get it serviced every year by the dealer. It started last year, after an hour it would sputter and die. It has gotten worse and is now down to 20 minutes. It feels like someone cuts off the fuel. Once it dies it does not want to start until you let it cool down. Cooling the engine, pumps, hoses, and components with fine water spray for a couple minutes will buy me another 10-20 minutes of run time so I think its external to the engine. It dies more going down hill then up hill. Once it dies going down hill I can restart it and mow uphill (forward/reverse/repeat) for another 5 minutes but it will die going up hill when it gets hotter. It doesn't matter if its 85 or 60 deg outside, I get 20 minutes of run time. The engine temp is quite different and the other morning wasn't even half way on the gauge. heat gun shows injector pump shuts off the first time at 175 deg, with the 3 injector supply lines at 180. After cooling with garden hose the injector pump shuts down the 2nd and 3rd time at 150 to 160 with supply lines at 165. So I don't think its injector pump. The fact the cool water immediately fixes the problem makes me think its not the injectors themselves.

    I've replaced the filter and fuel solenoid.
    Checked all hose connections.
    I added a 12v pump between the tank and lift pump to make sure I was getting positive fuel pressure to the injector pump and not having any leaks.
    I tightened the screws on the lift pump housing (got 1/4 turn on each of them)
    I've topped off the tank to make sure the supply line inside was not getting air.

    I have ordered and will be replacing the following:
    Fuel bowl and o-ring
    All 3 braided hoses
    Lift Pump


    I've read a lot of posts about this tractor dying and a lot of suggestions. However none of them with my symptoms.
    1. It happens when one of the external components gets hot
    2. It shuts off downhill at a lower temp then up hill
    3. fine mist cooling of components resets it.


    Do I need to:
    Replace Battery?
    Remove fuel Solenoid and put in a manual fuel valve?


    When I changed out the solenoid for the first time, I got an hour and thought I had it fixed, but it went right back to what it was doing. Do I have a bad battery and did it burn up my new solenoid?

    Thank you!!
    Load test the battery. But if the battery is starting the tractor fine and functioning without having to have a charger added when you are trying to restart, it's unlikely the battery. But as I mentioned in my earlier post, load test the battery.

    DO NOT replace the solenoid with a manual fuel valve. You would be opening a can of worms with the operating computer and also, it will nearly impossible to do this without "Jerry rigging" the valve and cable and making a mess of an otherwise nearly new machine. The fuel solennoid has a very defined testing procedure with an Ohm meter.

    I would definately suggest ordering a Technical Service manual IMMEDIATELY for your machine from the Dealer. It's available on CD Rom or in book form, the CD Rom is about 1/2 the price of the book. You need the wiring diagrams and also the testing procedures. Do this before buying or replacing any more parts. They have a definitive step of tests and procedures to follow and it tells you how to perform them. The Technical Service manual is critical for tractor ownership....You will find it extremely helpful.

    A couple of questions......

    What happens if you are NOT running the PTO and just running the tractor for 20 minutes or more? Does it still quit at the 20 minute interval (my guess is it doesn't).......??

    Have you replaced the Inner and Outer Air Filter elements and cleaned the housing and reset the gauge on the filter housing which shows the resistance and obstruction within the air filter?

    Have you had the Operator platform off the tractor and pulled the fuel supply and return lines out of the tank to actually check them? I have a feeling the fuel pick up is all gummed up and cruddy......You have to lift out the fuel gauge indicator as the lines are attached to it.

    Pull the entire guage unit and check the metal lines on it in the tank. Some units had a "V" shaped "pick up screen" on the end of the fuel supply line and these can get plugged and gunked up. Even if it looks clean, clean everything on the fuel lines. Also, blow some air through the guage unit VERY CAREFULLY to make sure there is no obstruction in the units steel fuel lines, either of them......

    Make sure to pay attention to the actual position of the fuel gauge indicator in the tank. I would mark the fuel level indicator so it can be installed back exactly as it was otherwise, the gauge might not work correctly. The manual float on the level indicator has to swing and pivot inside the tank and if you attempt to re install it not in the same position, it can cause the gauge to hang up or not show the correct fuel level. So, use a bright marker and draw a line on the assembly and on the tank before you remove it so you put it back exactly like it should be,

    Also, make sure the gasket isn't leaking or damaged or torn when you remove the fuel indicator, if it is, replace the gasket or you can have fuel leaks, etc.

    johnH123 likes this.

    1025R with Mauser Cab
    (10/2017)/ 120R FEL / RC2048 Mower / All of Ken's Bolt on Products / 60" HD Front Broom / 3 pt 45 Gallon Boom less Sprayer / CA2068 Core Aerator / I-Match / 54" Snow Plow w/ angling Quick Attach / Frontier 3 Pt Sprayer / Pallet Forks / 8 -42# Weights

    John Deere 455 (New in 9/1996) / MC519 Cart /60" MMM /47" Snow Thrower / 7'3" snow plow / Quick Hitch /
    4 -42# Weights / JD#10 Cart

    ExMark Lazer Z w/60" Deck , Billy Goat Blower , Full Stable of Echo Products





  9. Top | #7
    SulleyBear's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Last Online
    Today @ 05:26 PM
    Location
    Beautiful beaches, moderated summer heat and lake effect snows. Right where I want to be.
    Posts
    6,998
    Thanks
    1,413
    Thanked 2,493 Times in 1,402 Posts
    Another question......If when the tractor stops, if you just let it set and do NOT spray water or cool it down, how long does it take to get the machine restarted? This is important to know.......

    Is it still the same amount of time, or much longer?

    I have a feeling the water might be helping to complete the ground circuit and it's actually not a matter of the "cooling down".

    Also, as I asked in the last post, if you run the machine without using the PTO, do you still get the same "run time" and does it still quit at the 20 minutes.....?

    This is also important to know for diagnostic.....

    It's going to be helpful to know if somehow the "overheating" circuit for the PTO operation is actually kicking in and that's causing the machine to stop. Generally, the PTO should shut off, but the engine remain running, until the machine temp falls below a pre set level (230 degrees) but if the switch or circuit is malfunctioning, it's possible it could be shutting down the tractor. That's why it's helpful to know if the machine acts the same way whether you are using the PTO or not when it stops running.

    Do you have any of the safety switched over ridden or bypassed? Like the seat switch, or brake switch, etc?

    1025R with Mauser Cab
    (10/2017)/ 120R FEL / RC2048 Mower / All of Ken's Bolt on Products / 60" HD Front Broom / 3 pt 45 Gallon Boom less Sprayer / CA2068 Core Aerator / I-Match / 54" Snow Plow w/ angling Quick Attach / Frontier 3 Pt Sprayer / Pallet Forks / 8 -42# Weights

    John Deere 455 (New in 9/1996) / MC519 Cart /60" MMM /47" Snow Thrower / 7'3" snow plow / Quick Hitch /
    4 -42# Weights / JD#10 Cart

    ExMark Lazer Z w/60" Deck , Billy Goat Blower , Full Stable of Echo Products





  10. Top | #8
    SulleyBear's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Last Online
    Today @ 05:26 PM
    Location
    Beautiful beaches, moderated summer heat and lake effect snows. Right where I want to be.
    Posts
    6,998
    Thanks
    1,413
    Thanked 2,493 Times in 1,402 Posts
    Jason, also note that the machines UNDER serial number 40,000 have the fuel pick up style like is shown in the illustration I posted.

    Machines with serial number 40,001 and higher use a different style fuel pick up and it doesn't use a float and the mechanical gauge sending unit function. In fact, the fuel lines might even be positioned differently, depending upon your machine's serial number.

    If it is 40,000 or LOWER, the fuel pick up in the tank is likely contained in the sending unit, near the base of it. When you remove the sending unit, clean it very well with carb cleaner or even "brake clean" as long as you let it air dry before you reinstall it in the tank.

    Carefully look around in the tank when you have the sending unit removed with a flashlight and see if there is any "fungus" or mold appearing crud anywhere. There shouldn't be if you run any of the diesel fuel conditioners and there very well may be some issues if you don't run a fuel conditioner and treatment YEAR AROUND, in EVERY TANK OF FUEL.......

    All it takes is some moisture in the fuel and you can get algae in the fuel tank, which will cause all kinds of issues.

    If you see anything out of the ordinary in the tank, or even questionable, drain the tank and clean it with a product designed to eliminate fuel algae and then fill the tank with new, treated fuel.

    One other thing to keep in mind, Jason. A machine which is running with the fuel supply restricted due to possible crud in the pick up, or a machine which has the air cleaners dirty, can increase the engine operating temps measurably. That is why i raised these issues in the other posts. Also, a machine with plugged or obstructed air filters can make a machine run rich, which will usually increase the heat as well.

    With 550 hours, I would doubt your machine's PTO clutch is worn out......but it all depends on the type of stuff you cut with the mower. If it's normal grass, and you are lopping off a couple of inches, then the PTO clutch should have normal wear. But if you are often cutting wet, heavy grass or very thick and tall weeds / grass, the PTO clutch could be worn and slipping and this will increase the operating temps of the engine as well. Chances are the PTO clutch is OK, but that's why I ask about the machine operation and how it acts when the PTO is used and when it's NOT used...............

    If you notice the machine engine slowing down when mowing, or the blade speed on the deck slowing when the mower is in deep grass, yet the engine is still at WOT, it could be a severely worn PTO clutch. But they don't cause the engine to stop running, the worn PTO impcts the cutting speed, the blade speed on the deck and it will show the tractor operating temps much higher.

    1025R with Mauser Cab
    (10/2017)/ 120R FEL / RC2048 Mower / All of Ken's Bolt on Products / 60" HD Front Broom / 3 pt 45 Gallon Boom less Sprayer / CA2068 Core Aerator / I-Match / 54" Snow Plow w/ angling Quick Attach / Frontier 3 Pt Sprayer / Pallet Forks / 8 -42# Weights

    John Deere 455 (New in 9/1996) / MC519 Cart /60" MMM /47" Snow Thrower / 7'3" snow plow / Quick Hitch /
    4 -42# Weights / JD#10 Cart

    ExMark Lazer Z w/60" Deck , Billy Goat Blower , Full Stable of Echo Products





  11. Top | #9

    Join Date
    May 2017
    Last Online
    Today @ 05:17 AM
    Location
    SE Wisconsin
    Posts
    108
    Thanks
    1
    Thanked 29 Times in 22 Posts
    I would connect a voltmeter to the red and black wires at the fuel solenoid and mow with it until it dies. You obviously will have battery voltage there while it is running but when it dies a loss or reduction in voltage would indicate an electrical problem with the tractor. If there is still battery voltage there unplug the solenoid and check resistance from red to black (across the hold in coil aprox 25 ohms) to confirm that the coil in the solenoid is not going open circuit when it gets hot. If resistance is good you most likely have a problem on the fuel delivery system.
    Attached Files Attached Files
    Jason W likes this.

  12. Top | #10
    George of Buford's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Last Online
    09-17-2019 @ 11:28 AM
    Location
    GA.
    Posts
    53
    Thanks
    4
    Thanked 7 Times in 5 Posts
    One of my X595 tractors was doing the same thing at 175 degrees. The Yanmar diesels are equipped with an over temperature switch and relay to shutdown the PTO if the tractor is over 230 degrees. Checking the switch is very simple. On the thermostat housing there are two devices with a wire connected to them. The smaller one is a temperature sensor for the temperature gauge. The larger one (Left side) is the temperature switch. Just unplug it and mow with the tractor. If the engine does not die, the temperature switch, CH15516 is bad.

    George of Buford
    Last edited by George of Buford; 06-27-2018 at 09:00 AM.

  13. Remove Advertisements
    GreenTractorTalk.com
    Advertisements
     

Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts