mower deck barely turns
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    mower deck barely turns

    I have a John Deere 425 with a 60" deck. When engaging the PTO, the PTO light comes on, the shaft spins. The engine does not speed up as if there is no load and the blades barely creep. The belt is not slipping and all 3 spindles turn freely. I'm desperate and need help or suggestions. Thanks

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    You need a mechanically inclined person to look at the machine for you,, something is wrong,,

    or,, swap the engine for something larger,, possibly a 1962 Chevy 409HP/409 ??

    Sorry, I had to do that,,,

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    tj1
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    Quote Originally Posted by 409/409 View Post
    I have a John Deere 425 with a 60" deck. When engaging the PTO, the PTO light comes on, the shaft spins. The engine does not speed up as if there is no load and the blades barely creep. The belt is not slipping and all 3 spindles turn freely. I'm desperate and need help or suggestions. Thanks
    What RPM are you running at when you initiate the PTO? and what RPM do you go to after the pto is engaged.. Full bore is expected when you are mowing even if you don't have a 409 under the hood as CADPLANS recommended! Funny guy that he is!
    The slow spinning of the blades has me baffled if you are at WOT..

    What about the deck belt? Tension pretty good?
    Last edited by tj1; 07-30-2018 at 12:54 PM.
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    Jeff

    X 738 4X4/ 54" mower deck, 47" two stage snow thrower/ linear actuator spout control, Curtis hard side cab/heater, JD roof top LED work lights, Curtis fuse block, rear roof light connected to dash light switch and reverse lights, additional 20amp alternator, Curtis fast Cast 2000 sander custom fitted to tractor/ vibrator for use with dry sand, Kubota L39 TLB, JD 450 E dozer, Husky 18 horse/ 48" mower deck/Berco 42" two stage snow thrower/Berco soft side cab, Kubota RTV500-H.

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    bloodrunsgreen's Avatar
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    Is the PTO solenoid fully engaging in the rear unit which activates the PTO? Thinking it is stuck or not working right.
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    SulleyBear's Avatar
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    If you are running the engine at a high speed or at WOT, and the deck is barely spinning, chances are the PTO clutch has worn out in the rear unit.

    Another sign of the PTO clutch being shot is the least resistance on the blades will slow them down or stop them, such as pulling into real tall grass.

    When the PTO clutch is slipping, the rear hydro unit will develop a lot of heat in a hurry and can actually cause the engine temps to increase and run hot because of the heating of the hydro oil and running the hot oil through the radiator oil cooler section.

    If the engine is operating OK and the engine speed is normal and the deck blade speed is a problem, it's likely the PTO clutch.

    If the engine speed is slow and you can't increase the engine speed, the deck speed would also be very slow. In fact, engaging the PTO clutch at too low of an RPM of engine speed can stall the engine.

    So, we need to know, is it the engine which is running slow, causing the deck to also run slow (which it would do) or is the engine speed fine and the deck speed is super slow?


    We need more specific details to help you.

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    Your sure you haven't sheared a shear pin on the drive line somewhere and it has enough friction left to get the blades going around but not able to cut anything?
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    SulleyBear's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CADplans View Post


    You need a mechanically inclined person to look at the machine for you,, something is wrong,,

    or,, swap the engine for something larger,, possibly a 1962 Chevy 409HP/409 ??

    Sorry, I had to do that,,,

    Yeah, I have had days like that where I just have to post such an answer, but I am not sure the OP appreciates the extent of and attempts at humor when they are faced with the problem.......But some of us do.....

    The real question is, how does he hook the 409 / 409 to the Rear Hydro unit, with a Powerglide or manual 4 speed....?? Using the powerglide eliminates the clutch pedal fab requirements.... Getting the side panels to fit might be a bit challenging and closing the hood will also require some "custom fab work".....

    Now, we just need some clarification on his actual tractor problem, is it engine speed slowing the deck or a slow deck with normal engine speed? I can't really tell from the way he framed the question.......
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    SulleyBear's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JD4044M View Post
    Your sure you haven't sheared a shear pin on the drive line somewhere and it has enough friction left to get the blades going around but not able to cut anything?
    That tractor uses a shaft driven deck right from the mid PTO shaft and while there are pins in the driveshaft assembly, breaking one of those would be an all or nothing sort of issue. You either have deck rotation or you don't, from my personal experience.

    Depending upon the hours on the machine and it's general service history, it could very well be the PTO clutch. I have replaced a few of those in that specific model of tractor over the years (in a 445 and a 455 which use the same rear end assembly from Tuff Torq).

    If he has normal engine speed, my money is on the PTO clutch. If he doesn't have normal engine speed, then it could be a throttle cable, it could be a bunch of other things and it's going to take much more information to help him narrow it down.

    If it is the PTO clutch, it's something which he won't want to attempt to replace himself if he doesn't have quite good mechanical skills and a technical service manual.

    Here is what the PTO clutch looks like on that tractor, the last one I replaced was well outside the allowable tolerance levels and was down to plate on plate with no material. If my memory serves me, I think the maximum tolerance on the clutch plate wear was 0.106" or 2.7 mm. You can see from the picture where the actual wear was. This also means the fluid is contaminated with clutch material and the hydro filter is very dirty and possibly near being plugged if it hasn't been regularly serviced.

    It still spun the deck but it was easily slowed down and tough grass would almost bring the blades to a stop despite the engine being at WOT.......

    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails IMG_20160618_165045174.jpg   IMG_20160618_165027235.jpg  

    1025R with Mauser Cab
    (10/2017)/ 120R FEL / RC2048 Mower / All of Ken's Bolt on Products / 60" HD Front Broom / 3 pt 45 Gallon Boom less Sprayer / CA2068 Core Aerator / I-Match / 54" Snow Plow w/ angling Quick Attach / Frontier 3 Pt Sprayer / Pallet Forks / 8 -42# Weights

    John Deere 455 (New in 9/1996) / MC519 Cart /60" MMM /47" Snow Thrower / 7'3" snow plow / Quick Hitch /
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    tj1
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    Quote Originally Posted by SulleyBear View Post
    Yeah, I have had days like that where I just have to post such an answer, but I am not sure the OP appreciates the extent of and attempts at humor when they are faced with the problem.......But some of us do.....

    The real question is, how does he hook the 409 / 409 to the Rear Hydro unit, with a Powerglide or manual 4 speed....?? Using the powerglide eliminates the clutch pedal fab requirements.... Getting the side panels to fit might be a bit challenging and closing the hood will also require some "custom fab work".....

    Now, we just need some clarification on his actual tractor problem, is it engine speed slowing the deck or a slow deck with normal engine speed? I can't really tell from the way he framed the question.......
    he would need to talk to a wheelstander guy so you reverse the tranny and rear end back to the drive train! You're welcome SB.
    Jeff

    X 738 4X4/ 54" mower deck, 47" two stage snow thrower/ linear actuator spout control, Curtis hard side cab/heater, JD roof top LED work lights, Curtis fuse block, rear roof light connected to dash light switch and reverse lights, additional 20amp alternator, Curtis fast Cast 2000 sander custom fitted to tractor/ vibrator for use with dry sand, Kubota L39 TLB, JD 450 E dozer, Husky 18 horse/ 48" mower deck/Berco 42" two stage snow thrower/Berco soft side cab, Kubota RTV500-H.

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    Couple of other thoughts:

    PTO brake stuck????

    Passage that hydraulic oil that goes to PTO clutch is partially plugged

    Pump is not putting out correct (high enough) pressure to totally engage the PTO clutch.

    Most likely:

    Worn out PTO clutch parts
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