Electric linear actuator for MC519 dump
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Thread: Electric linear actuator for MC519 dump

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    Electric linear actuator for MC519 dump

    Last year I fabbed up a hydraulic dump cylinder on my MC519 cart for my x758 tractor. My dad saw it in action and would like to put something similar on his MC519 cart. However, he has a 345 tractor which doesn't have hydraulic ports available. I'd like to find a way to use an electric linear actuator instead for his setup.

    Has anyone done this before? What actuator did you choose? I know the physical dimensions required (6" stroke, about 13" collapsed and 19" extended). However, with electric actuators there seem to be a very wide range of force capacity (from under 20 to 300+ pounds) and speeds (from 0.25 inch/sec up to more than 1 inch/sec). Guessing at it, I think a speed of around 1 inch/sec seems like a good value. I should hook up mine and time it but my tractor is all set up for snowblowing right now. I also have no idea how much weight the actuator would have to push up at an angle when full of leaves.

    So if anyone has done this successfully please let me know.

    Thanks,
    Rob
    Herminator likes this.
    2016 x758 w/60" HC mower, 54" snowblower, MC519 bagger
    2010 2520 w/61" H130 loader, TA 42" forks, KK 60" Pro tiller, iMatch quick hitch, KK middle buster
    1996 345 - Traded
    Other toys: Stihl BR600 backpack blower; McCulloch chainsaws: 10-10S, 700, 805, 10-10; JD trimmer

    2520:__________________________x758:__________________________Faithful 345:___________________

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    Mods:

    Though I appreciate you trying to put this thread into the 'right' forum section I think the Deere Lawn & Garden section was the right place for it. This is specific to Deere garden tractors' MC519 cart and that's where the most people familiar with them happen to be. Could you please move it back?
    FortClatsop likes this.

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    I've installed several of these on Gator boxes so some of this should relate. Looking at your garden cart, 300# of thrust should easily handle a load of leaves or brush, rocks might be another story. Keep in mind, a 300# actuator won't lift 300# of load unless it's perpendicular to the load, which is rarely the case. The geometry of the attachment will have a lot to do with the actuator's lifting capacity. The closer your actuator is parallel to the load the lower the effective thrust.
    The easiest way to wire these things is to buy a cross-polarity three-way switch. The alternative is a couple relays, which is way too much work in my opinion.
    Herminator likes this.

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    Where do you get them from? What travel speed did you choose?

    Thanks,
    Rob
    Herminator likes this.
    2016 x758 w/60" HC mower, 54" snowblower, MC519 bagger
    2010 2520 w/61" H130 loader, TA 42" forks, KK 60" Pro tiller, iMatch quick hitch, KK middle buster
    1996 345 - Traded
    Other toys: Stihl BR600 backpack blower; McCulloch chainsaws: 10-10S, 700, 805, 10-10; JD trimmer

    2520:__________________________x758:__________________________Faithful 345:___________________

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    Do a search on ebay or Amazon for linear actuators and there'll be a ton of them come up in all sizes, load ranges and speeds. You'll probably be a bit disappointed in the speeds offered, most of them around 1/4"/second, so a 6" stroke would take around 24 seconds. You can get more speed, but it'll be at the expense of load capacity due to internal gearing. On a side note, Ironton (Northern Tool) seems to be the gold standard in actuators, but they're over twice the price of "cheap" no-name actuators. I've installed two Ironton actuators and then tried a no-name actuator. I couldn't tell the difference. Ya pays yer money and ya takes yer chances.

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    AEI components at accele.com sells IP65 rated actuators.

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    Thanks for the tips. I was hoping someone with a similar experience would be able to say "this one has the speed and capacity that you need for that use". Or at least have suggestions on what speed and what capacity is needed, beyond my gut feel.

    Rob
    FortClatsop likes this.
    2016 x758 w/60" HC mower, 54" snowblower, MC519 bagger
    2010 2520 w/61" H130 loader, TA 42" forks, KK 60" Pro tiller, iMatch quick hitch, KK middle buster
    1996 345 - Traded
    Other toys: Stihl BR600 backpack blower; McCulloch chainsaws: 10-10S, 700, 805, 10-10; JD trimmer

    2520:__________________________x758:__________________________Faithful 345:___________________

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    Any that have enough power will be very slow. Depending on what you want to dump, you may need more power than you might think. I use one rated at 1000 lbs to lift an 8x10 trex deck That weighs about 500 lbs. It does it fine, but is very slow (about 1 min/ft). Also, where you position it on the trailer will affect performance. Placing where the stroke is short will shorten time to lift, but you need more power the closer you are to the pivot point, a lot more power. I also modified a trailer for hydraulic dump. and have looked at this a good bit. I came to the conclusion that linear actuators were not the way to go if you plan to dump heavy material. No free lunch. Best to look at a self-contained 12V hydraulic dump system. Expensive and rather large. Or get a tractor with hydraulics

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    Quote Originally Posted by gittyup View Post
    Any that have enough power will be very slow. Depending on what you want to dump, you may need more power than you might think. I use one rated at 1000 lbs to lift an 8x10 trex deck That weighs about 500 lbs. It does it fine, but is very slow (about 1 min/ft). Also, where you position it on the trailer will affect performance. Placing where the stroke is short will shorten time to lift, but you need more power the closer you are to the pivot point, a lot more power. I also modified a trailer for hydraulic dump. and have looked at this a good bit. I came to the conclusion that linear actuators were not the way to go if you plan to dump heavy material. No free lunch. Best to look at a self-contained 12V hydraulic dump system. Expensive and rather large. Or get a tractor with hydraulics
    That's really what I need to figure out at this point... How much weight will it have to handle? I see that the specs of the MC519 cart say it can carry up to 500# of material but I'm very certain a load of leaves (which is all my dad's tractor will be used for - hardly any grass) has got to be much less than that. If I had to guess, I'd say a full load of leaves (dry and partially chopped up, as you'd typically bag them) would be less than 200#. Couple that with the fact that only about 2/3 of the weight would be pushing down on the front of the cart since part of the load counterbalances that while hanging behind the pivot point. So I need to get some formulas and do some math as to the moment forces involved and see what I come up with. I'm hoping a linear actuator of about 200# capacity will end up being enough, because I found a good one with that capacity and a decent speed.

    Rob
    2016 x758 w/60" HC mower, 54" snowblower, MC519 bagger
    2010 2520 w/61" H130 loader, TA 42" forks, KK 60" Pro tiller, iMatch quick hitch, KK middle buster
    1996 345 - Traded
    Other toys: Stihl BR600 backpack blower; McCulloch chainsaws: 10-10S, 700, 805, 10-10; JD trimmer

    2520:__________________________x758:__________________________Faithful 345:___________________

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    Quote Originally Posted by BigBlue View Post
    That's really what I need to figure out at this point... How much weight will it have to handle? I see that the specs of the MC519 cart say it can carry up to 500# of material but I'm very certain a load of leaves (which is all my dad's tractor will be used for - hardly any grass) has got to be much less than that. If I had to guess, I'd say a full load of leaves (dry and partially chopped up, as you'd typically bag them) would be less than 200#.

    Couple that with the fact that only about 2/3 of the weight would be pushing down on the front of the cart since part of the load counterbalances that while hanging behind the pivot point.

    So I need to get some formulas and do some math as to the moment forces involved and see what I come up with. I'm hoping a linear actuator of about 200# capacity will end up being enough, because I found a good one with that capacity and a decent speed.

    Rob
    Although it may initially plan to be used for just leafs (hopefully dry ones), as the handiness of the auto dump feature becomes more appreciated, the use of the cart will probably increase and so could it's loads. I have used an MC519 cart for 20 plus years and I have had the weight of the cart vary significantly. With the weather we have had this year, while the goal may have been to get only dry leaves, the reality is that the leaves were always damp or wet. Normally, I can dump the Mc519 cart from the seat of the tractor, but this fall, the loads were so heavy that I had to get off the tractor and stand in front of the MC cart to dump it. I would bet all of those loads this fall were near the stated 500 pound limit.

    Also, as you know, the more debris in the cart, the more it impacts the top canvas cover, which has to hinge in the clam shell for the cart to tip. The debris being full restricts the clam shell opening of the cover, even if you pull the lever to first hinge the cover because of the weight of the material pushing on the very back of the cover, which serves as the "tailgate" of the cart.

    When the material is damp or wet, its density against the rear flap changes dramatically. This adds a lot of resistance to the initial movement of the cart being tipped until it reaches the point where the base and the cover fully separate and are moving in opposite directions.

    The cart fills against the rear of the cover first as the material is blown in and then fills forward, as I am sure you have experienced when you were dumping the cart "in the old days before the hydraulic assist" system you have added. When the material is damp or wet, it packs against the rear of the cover and builds the pile in the rear of the cart. When the leaves or material are dry, they often swirl about in the cart and tend to settle more evenly and aren't as packed against the rear of the cover, which is the "tailgate" of the cart when using it.

    Often, by time the cart "feels full" it's packed tightly against the rear of the cover which acts as the tail gate of the MC cart. This changes the dumping effort required dramatically.


    Bottom line, I think it would be very wise to use an actuator which is more towards the load limit of 500 pounds than towards the light end. With the hydraulic actuator, if the load exceeds the capacity, the system go into somewhat of a "bypass" mode, not damaging anything. But the electric actuator could possibly be overloaded if the capacity isn't high enough for the load and damage the actuator or harness.

    If you have posted a thread about the hydraulic actuator, I would sure like to see how you mounted the pieces, routed the lines, etc. as this is a very handy feature to have on the cart. Did you write a thread or post pictures on the hydraulic assist feature you added to your cart? I would like to see those as well as any for the electric actuator on this project.

    No doubt the assisted lift, ideally hydraulic or even electrical would make using the cart even more handy than it already is. Looking forward to see how you have done the hydraulic system and how the electrical one works out. It's a Very good idea.............

    1025R with Mauser Cab
    (10/2017)/ 120R FEL / RC2048 Mower / All of Ken's Bolt on Products / 60" HD Front Broom / 3 pt 45 Gallon Boom less Sprayer / CA2068 Core Aerator / I-Match / 54" Snow Plow w/ angling Quick Attach / Frontier 3 Pt Sprayer / Pallet Forks / 8 -42# Weights

    John Deere 455 (New in 9/1996) / MC519 Cart /60" MMM /47" Snow Thrower / 7'3" snow plow / Quick Hitch /
    4 -42# Weights / JD#10 Cart

    ExMark Lazer Z w/60" Deck , Billy Goat Blower , Full Stable of Echo Products





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