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  1. Top | #11
    trboxman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheR2Guys View Post
    Yeah, thanks USPS. I wish I could say this has never happened before...

    I don't know if this happens in the first mile, somewhere in the middle, or at the end. My wife's family is three generations of postal workers, and each one of them I know gave their all every day. I'm assuming most of the postal workers are like that, and yet stuff like this somehow still does happen on occasion. I hope you can see we taped the heck out of the box and individually wrapped each Edge Tamer, but even that won't save it if it is that badly treated. When this happens it looks like the package was physically dropped from a high place, and I don't understand how that would even happen...in our local post office they go in cages which get loaded onto trucks, and because these are the heaviest packages, they go on the bottom of each cage.

    If it weren't prohibitively expensive we would ship them fedex or UPS, at least then we could use our own boxes. But the by-weight shipping would be murder (that box was almost 30 lbs).

    I'm sorry USPS beat up your Edge Tamers before you had the chance to , but something tells me you'll give them plenty a good workout yourself

    Have a great weekend,

    The R2 Guys
    The Edge Tamers were well wrapped and it's clear that you take care to ensure that they are tight in the box so as to minimize them shifting around inside during shipping. However I do believe that 2 evenly spaced wraps of tape around the circumference of the box on the long dimension would have kept the box tearing to a minimum. Don't know if it happens enough to make that change worth the expense though.

    I order some stuff from China and they completely wrap the box in shipping tape, every inch of cardboard is covered, and there are times that the box no longer looks square or rectangular but the tape holds everything inside. It's the darndest thing when you get a tape covered lump and cut it open to realize that it was once a square box...
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  3. Top | #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by mjncad View Post


    What would UPS or FedEx charge for that shipment? Back in 2008 I bought a tooth-bar from the now defunct Markham Welding and it cost me about $47 via UPS ground and that tooth-bar weighs more than 30-pounds.

    I know you folks are a small business; but this kind of crap that USPS pulls can be detrimental to your business as people equate shipping with the company making the product. Last year I bought some items from two small companies, and one flat out said on their website at the time that they don't ship USPS due to the crappy service. The other company strongly urged customers to use UPS or FedEx for the same reason; but offered USPS if someone wanted it with the disclaimer that any packages lost or damaged by USPS are not their problem.
    We struggle with this too, but not quite as bad as R2 since their products are considerably heavier. Every time I price a shipment from UPS for a customer the quote is $5-$8 more than the USPS and it's 5 days to them, no one else can compare with the priority flat-rate box charge AND 2-3 day delivery times.

    We ship a lot of boxes...and I mean A LOT of boxes, and the reality is that in the 5+ years we have been doing this, we have filed only 4 claims for lost packages all all where paid quickly.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kennyd View Post
    We struggle with this too, but not quite as bad as R2 since their products are considerably heavier. Every time I price a shipment from UPS for a customer the quote is $5-$8 more than the USPS and it's 5 days to them, no one else can compare with the priority flat-rate box charge AND 2-3 day delivery times.

    We ship a lot of boxes...and I mean A LOT of boxes, and the reality is that in the 5+ years we have been doing this, we have filed only 4 claims for lost packages all all where paid quickly.
    Still to this day nobody has beat Kenny and USPS. I ordered my diff lock pedal at 10:11am on a Saturday and when I got home from work Monday I was putting it on my tractor
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  8. Top | #14
    glc
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    I'll play devils advocate here.
    I definitely would not be blaming USPS. That box isn't meant for that kind of weight.
    I understand wanting to ship via the cheapest method available, but common sense has to play a part somewhere. If using that type of box, then IMHO, use a reinforced packing tape on the whole thing. It wouldn't have come apart.

    I've shipped tons of heavy items at work over the years. I always thought about the abuse that could occur.
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  9. Top | #15
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    Everyone (well most everyone) is so quick to blame USPS. Iíve seen many similar posts about UPS and FedEx.

    Itís all in how it is packaged. All these compainies use an automated conveyor system. The ones I have seen at USPS hubs do drop each package from one to the other at times.

    At most modern facilities there is a robot that picks those cages up and dumps them on the conveyor. The only time an employee touches that box is when it is first picked up from the shipper and when it is at the final delivery to you.

    Take a look at the first 30 seconds of this video and you will see how packages are handled. Packaging properly is the key.

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    My apologies for not directly quoting the guys that I'll be referring to....

    I agree that having a UPS or FedEx shipping OPTION would be good for those folks that want to pony up for the extra expense. But I can also see R2's position that it does add to the shipping process and expense to the end user. Plus, they'd probably have to do some (maybe expensive) work on their website to have a UPS and/or FedEx shipping calculator added to it rather than just having the "flat rate" option. Would I opt for the extra expense when I finally get around to ordering my EdgeTamers? Don't know.

    Someone mentioned that those boxes weren't designed for that much weight. That's probably true. Yeah, the extra tape might help. But... here's another potential option - Back in my Jeeping days I ran into a guy that sold very heavy steel parts for bumpers, tire carriers, etc. He always shipped them in a "If it fits, it ships" box. And he told me that sometimes his boxes could approach 60+ pounds per box. He basically built a "box within the box" to reinforce it. Maybe R2 could look into having some boxes made that would essentially slip inside the USPS box and that might take care of the problem. Shopping around with a packaging company might find someone that's already got the tooling for something like that already made up.

    R2 might also consider a shipping label affixed to the bottom of each EdgeTamer with the recipient's address on it so if the box does come undone, there's a chance that USPS might take the individual pieces and send them on to the buyer.
    Last edited by mark02tj; 02-04-2018 at 11:15 AM. Reason: clarified something
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    Quote Originally Posted by PJR832 View Post
    And that's the truth, Kenny knows how to package his stuff.
    I should add that I never did ask how the package I sent Kenny arrived, I know Iím not a professional packager but I also know it very heavy.
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    Quote Originally Posted by glc View Post
    I'll play devils advocate here.
    I definitely would not be blaming USPS. That box isn't meant for that kind of weight.
    I understand wanting to ship via the cheapest method available, but common sense has to play a part somewhere. If using that type of box, then IMHO, use a reinforced packing tape on the whole thing. It wouldn't have come apart.

    I've shipped tons of heavy items at work over the years. I always thought about the abuse that could occur.
    Both have a role to play. I tried to cover that without being guns blazing on a well respected mfg and supplier to the tractor community. I wanted Edge Tamers purchased, shipped and delivered at a reasonable price, I feel that I got that...but it was so very close to a tale of frustration due to lost items.

    You're right the box wasn't made for the weight and reinforced tape would have likely prevented this particular damage but my goodness the USPS handling techniques are pretty darned rough. I wanted R2 to see the damage and choose to change their practices or not...it's unlikely I'll ever need to purchase another Edge Tamer as they'll likely last a lifetime. My gambling on whether they get here intact or not is over, they're here, no loss so I'm good.

    Having to adjust the packing to match the handling is kinda like why we now have dull tasting ruggedized tomatoes to stand up to picking and processing vs. those nice thin skinned and tasty heirloom tomatoes that you only get if you grow them yourself or buy them at a local farmer's market.
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  15. Top | #19
    trboxman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mark02tj View Post

    R2 might also consider a shipping label affixed to the bottom of each EdgeTamer with the recipient's address on it so if the box does come undone, there's a chance that USPS might take the individual pieces and send them on to the buyer.
    Perfect addition! I once ordered 4 new rims for a performance car and got 3 because 1 was lost by UPS and they had no way of knowing what the final destination was...simply because there weren't shipping labels on all 4 boxes. The shipper had banded two boxes together to make one shipping package and only applied a label to one of the banded boxes in each pair instead of all. Both UPS and the shipper share responsibility for the issue.
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    There are a lot of great points in this thread, part of why we love being a vendor on GTT. We will be working later this year with other shippers, though in the US for Edge Tamers it is unlikely anyone would choose anything but USPS. For point of comparison, trboxman's shipping, instead of being $21, would have been $70 if it came UPS. The interest in other shippers is more for international customers. For small, dense products like the Edge Tamers, USPS is hard to beat. We also really appreciated coaltrain's video; you can imagine if a stack of 20-30 lb boxes (at times we ship a lot at once) were being tossed through the conveyer together it is easy to conceive that they could be pretty roughed up. This would have been especially prevalent when we were paying down the backorder, which we have now completed.

    As Kenny stated, USPS's loss rate is remarkably low. Even if a package gets held up in the system from time to time, it always eventually gets there. We wrap the boxes pretty heavily with tape to prevent this sort of thing, and yes reinforced tape can help but it is considerably more expensive. Similarly with the box in a box idea. In either of those cases, we would incur extra expense that we'd have to pass on, as our business is not geared towards making money on shipping. So that's an option.

    At the end of the day, an overwhelming amount of the time the package gets there with no problem, but there will always be the few exceptions. I'm bummed that trboxman was one of them. But I am glad he brought this up, because it gives us a lot to think about to improve the shipping. Necessity may be the mother of invention, but feedback is the father of improvement. So thank you!
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