2305 - Independent lift for MMM - Need help clearing up confusion
Results 1 to 7 of 7
Like Tree1Likes
  • 1 Post By SulleyBear

Thread: 2305 - Independent lift for MMM - Need help clearing up confusion

  1. Top | #1

    Join Date
    Oct 2018
    Last Online
    10-12-2019 @ 11:26 PM
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    15
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post

    2305 - Independent lift for MMM - Need help clearing up confusion

    I've been reading about this for seemingly months. I need some help clearing up some confusion here.

    I have a 2305 that has a hydraulic line coming out near the connections underneath. I have to hook it up to one of the connections if I want to use the lift system for my MMM.

    I want to hook it up to the green valve which should allow me to control the MMM lift by pushing the SVC forward and backwards. I want to do this because it feels better and the functionality seems to make better sense to me - mainly that I can kick the SVC forward into the float position and it should drop the MMM to it's set level and leave it there. The person who owned it before me tagged it with the yellow color, implying it should hook up to the yellow hydraulic connection. This would make it controlled via left/right movement of the SVC. This doesn't really seem to make sense to me. Does it matter? Is there some pro/con i'm not considering in this decision?

    My understanding is that, give what's mentioned above, this means I have an independent lift set up. IE: my MMM raise/lower is not tied to my 3 point hitch (Which I believe is referred to as mechanical lift?) Is this correct?

    Assuming that is correct... my MMM will not stay up in the locked mode for traveling. I believe this is 'by design' (even if poorly so?) when you have the independent lift? IE: I should stop pulling my hair out that this thing won't stay locked in the highest position?

    Finally... I'm also pulling my hair out over the general idea that my MMM is not staying where it should based on the selector dial in the floor board. How do you test this? How is this supposed to behave?

    My current thought is to set it, kick the SVC into float and let it drop, and measure the distance between the blades and the concrete floor. Rise and repeat with different cut levels selected. Verify i'm getting different heights as appropriate.

    (This is my first real tractor, so all of this is new to me. I'm reading what I can but it's a lot to take in... i'm finding myself easily confused)

  2. Remove Advertisements
    GreenTractorTalk.com
    Advertisements
     

  3. Top | #2
    SulleyBear's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Last Online
    Yesterday @ 05:06 PM
    Location
    Beautiful beaches, moderated summer heat and lake effect snows. Right where I want to be.
    Posts
    7,146
    Thanks
    1,427
    Thanked 2,545 Times in 1,426 Posts
    I should state I don't have a 2305 but Frankly, as long as the lift mechanism is getting hydraulic flow from ONE of the 4 ports, I really don't see why is should matter which of the 4 ports becomes the source of the hydraulic pressure for the lift function.

    I certainly can't see any harm in trying to connect the lift hose to the port which makes the most sense to you. As far as the height adjustment, I will have to go look at the John Deere Parts system to see what it looks like on your machine as I am not familiar with the 2305. I will report back on that in another post.

    Also, it should be noted, that the four ports are controlled with specific SCV lever movements, as you have mentioned. I know on my 1025r and also my 455, I am used to very specific lever movements for controlling my snow plow angles and lift. One fall, I hooked up the lines differently and I could not overcome the prior muscle memory of the way I had done it for years.

    Every time I desired to lower the blade, I always push the control lever on my 455 and the second lever at the steering wheel controls the blade angle. Finally, I just had to stop the machine and reposition the lines to the places which are "correct" for the way I have always used it. Plowing snow, you are constantly making adjustments and when I would go to lift the blade before correcting the lines, I would raise the front wheels.

    Moral of the story, as long as you are providing fluid flow through a selected line based upon the direction of the control lever which makes sense to you, it shouldn't matter which line it is as long as it corresponds to the one you desire to use.

    By the way, I think your understanding of the MMM lift function is pretty good from learning it in theory .....

    1025R with Mauser Cab
    (10/2017)/ 120R FEL / RC2048 Mower / All of Ken's Bolt on Products / 60" HD Front Broom / 3 pt 45 Gallon Boom less Sprayer / CA2068 Core Aerator / I-Match / 54" Snow Plow w/ angling Quick Attach / Frontier 3 Pt Sprayer / Pallet Forks / 8 -42# Weights

    John Deere 455 (New in 9/1996) / MC519 Cart /60" MMM /47" Snow Thrower / 7'3" snow plow / Quick Hitch /
    4 -42# Weights / JD#10 Cart

    ExMark Lazer Z w/60" Deck , Billy Goat Blower , Full Stable of Echo Products





  4. Top | #3
    SulleyBear's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Last Online
    Yesterday @ 05:06 PM
    Location
    Beautiful beaches, moderated summer heat and lake effect snows. Right where I want to be.
    Posts
    7,146
    Thanks
    1,427
    Thanked 2,545 Times in 1,426 Posts
    Regarding the mower adjustment, here is an image of the mechanism from the parts page and a link to the page for your reference. It looks like it is using the stepped cam to control the mower height and once you adjust the cam to the level you want and lower the mower, its supposed to stop at that adjusted height. I know these cams wear on some machines and also, sometimes the wear permits the mower to drop from step to step on the adjustment cam. Is this the issue you are having with controlling the height?

    Often, people are hoping the adjustment will correspond to specific heights in inches and frankly many of these machines which use the rotating stepped cam don't seem to have the precision of say a commercial mower in the actual deck height adjustment. Usually, people measure the actual deck height at the various knob settings and then either make a note of it or mark their desired mowing heights on their deck height indicator knob or decal. If you are looking for 4" of mowing height, then you will likely have to measure from the blade to the level surface at each of the possible mower height settings to find the settings which closest meet your needs.

    This has long been a point of contention on the mower height adjustment on many of these small tractors and frankly the new machines aren't much different than the prior models when it comes to setting the mower deck height.

    Hope this is helpful.

    Please let us know if you have more questions or need other help on this or other tractor related topics.



    John Deere Parts Catalog
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Screenshot_2019-08-28 John Deere Parts Catalog.png  
    xoted likes this.

    1025R with Mauser Cab
    (10/2017)/ 120R FEL / RC2048 Mower / All of Ken's Bolt on Products / 60" HD Front Broom / 3 pt 45 Gallon Boom less Sprayer / CA2068 Core Aerator / I-Match / 54" Snow Plow w/ angling Quick Attach / Frontier 3 Pt Sprayer / Pallet Forks / 8 -42# Weights

    John Deere 455 (New in 9/1996) / MC519 Cart /60" MMM /47" Snow Thrower / 7'3" snow plow / Quick Hitch /
    4 -42# Weights / JD#10 Cart

    ExMark Lazer Z w/60" Deck , Billy Goat Blower , Full Stable of Echo Products





  5. Remove Advertisements
    GreenTractorTalk.com
    Advertisements
     

  6. Top | #4
    SulleyBear's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Last Online
    Yesterday @ 05:06 PM
    Location
    Beautiful beaches, moderated summer heat and lake effect snows. Right where I want to be.
    Posts
    7,146
    Thanks
    1,427
    Thanked 2,545 Times in 1,426 Posts
    Here is what the lift cylinder and mechanism look like in the parts section for your machine.

    The following link opens the actual parts section for the lift cylinder and lists part numbers, etc. as well as showing their location and proximity to other components when you look at the various schematics and renderings. Once you get into the parts page, you need to select the specific pages you desire to view for more detail. They are listed to the right in the screen shot below and listed as 1, 2, 3 or 4 on the right side of the page. Open each one and see the detail for those components.

    Many of us use the parts illustrations to understand how the pieces are assembled. They are very accurate for the assembly order and seeing the parts and pieces involved.

    Hope this information is helpful.....and furthers your understanding of the system on your machine.

    John Deere Parts Catalog
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Screenshot_2019-08-28 John Deere Parts Catalog(1).png  

    1025R with Mauser Cab
    (10/2017)/ 120R FEL / RC2048 Mower / All of Ken's Bolt on Products / 60" HD Front Broom / 3 pt 45 Gallon Boom less Sprayer / CA2068 Core Aerator / I-Match / 54" Snow Plow w/ angling Quick Attach / Frontier 3 Pt Sprayer / Pallet Forks / 8 -42# Weights

    John Deere 455 (New in 9/1996) / MC519 Cart /60" MMM /47" Snow Thrower / 7'3" snow plow / Quick Hitch /
    4 -42# Weights / JD#10 Cart

    ExMark Lazer Z w/60" Deck , Billy Goat Blower , Full Stable of Echo Products





  7. Top | #5

    Join Date
    Oct 2018
    Last Online
    10-12-2019 @ 11:26 PM
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    15
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
    Definitely helpful, thank you very much!

    I'm going to be doing some things this weekend that require me to remove the MMM, so i'll have a good chance to craw under there and check things out.

    I also have the blade adjustment tool being delivered, which will help me measure where everything comes to rest and do some testing.

    To date, I've been basing things on how they look from the perspective of the MMM's case and the wheels, which means I could be imagining and issue I don't have.... we'll see

  8. Top | #6

    Join Date
    May 2013
    Last Online
    Today @ 01:19 AM
    Location
    CNY & Adirondacks
    Posts
    166
    Thanks
    412
    Thanked 42 Times in 33 Posts

    2305 mower

    I’m going by (alleged) memory here, I used to own a 2305 with mower and other attachments.


    The mechanical lift raises the deck by an upside-down ‘L' shaped (bell crank?) piece which is lifted by the left 3PH arm. The tractor came with a rod which was installed between the lift arms to hold them in place so the bell crank would engage. I replaced the rod with a drawbar, but if there is nothing keeping the lift arms spread, the deck will not raise with the 3PH.

    Hope this helps.
    1025r, H120, 54" snowblower, 60D MMM, 48" Woods BB, KK subsoiler & 48" brush hog, Curtis cab

  9. Top | #7
    chex313's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Last Online
    Yesterday @ 07:52 PM
    Location
    SE. PA.
    Posts
    892
    Thanks
    145
    Thanked 95 Times in 82 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by xoted View Post
    I've been reading about this for seemingly months. I need some help clearing up some confusion here.

    I have a 2305 that has a hydraulic line coming out near the connections underneath. I have to hook it up to one of the connections if I want to use the lift system for my MMM.

    I want to hook it up to the green valve which should allow me to control the MMM lift by pushing the SVC forward and backwards. I want to do this because it feels better and the functionality seems to make better sense to me - mainly that I can kick the SVC forward into the float position and it should drop the MMM to it's set level and leave it there. The person who owned it before me tagged it with the yellow color, implying it should hook up to the yellow hydraulic connection. This would make it controlled via left/right movement of the SVC. This doesn't really seem to make sense to me. Does it matter? Is there some pro/con i'm not considering in this decision?

    My understanding is that, give what's mentioned above, this means I have an independent lift set up. IE: my MMM raise/lower is not tied to my 3 point hitch (Which I believe is referred to as mechanical lift?) Is this correct?

    Assuming that is correct... my MMM will not stay up in the locked mode for traveling. I believe this is 'by design' (even if poorly so?) when you have the independent lift? IE: I should stop pulling my hair out that this thing won't stay locked in the highest position?

    Finally... I'm also pulling my hair out over the general idea that my MMM is not staying where it should based on the selector dial in the floor board. How do you test this? How is this supposed to behave?

    My current thought is to set it, kick the SVC into float and let it drop, and measure the distance between the blades and the concrete floor. Rise and repeat with different cut levels selected. Verify i'm getting different heights as appropriate.

    (This is my first real tractor, so all of this is new to me. I'm reading what I can but it's a lot to take in... i'm finding myself easily confused)
    To get it to stay up you should have a lock position...and all the height positions should keep it up at that position if its going down on anything but the full up position with the mmm not in the locked position something is indeed wrong.

    So typically I may lift my MMM all the way up for some rocks or something and eventually it will sag to the height position I have set on the knob....I think they may have changed the markings, I have install, lock and H , M , L...only my H positions are useful ...The others are too low.

    I always lock it up when done mowing . That way when I switch the hydraulics to loader its already out of the way.
    Last edited by chex313; 08-29-2019 at 03:32 PM.
    Dave's 2012 1026R TLB,54"MMM Auto Attach,Ken's hooks&clevis,Artillian 36' Forks and a KennyPedal WH 520H 48" Snow Blade,48" Deck379 Peterbuilt (3 Million Miles in a big truck)

  10. Remove Advertisements
    GreenTractorTalk.com
    Advertisements
     

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •