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There's been a lot of discussion on when perform the first oil change on our 1023e/1025r/1026r/ so I was thinking when SHOULD we get that first oil change out of the way? Tractor Tim stated in one of his video's that he split the difference of 50 hrs/100hrs and got his done at 75. Some say do it at 50, others say wait till 200hrs. I'm putting 15w-40 JD oil that my dealer gave me when I bought the tractor. So what do you folks think?:unknown:
 

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Going back to the earliest 1023E Owner's Manual in 2011 it lists the first engine oil/filter change at 200 hrs. However, it also lists that the engine oil/filter should be changed annually if used less than 200 hrs per year.

One of the discussions over the years has been what oil do you put in when doing the annual oil change if it takes you several years to get to 200 hrs?

I've had my tractor 7 years and I'm still not at 200 hrs. It took about 4 years to reach 100 hrs. Prior to 100 hrs. I changed the oil at the same time every year and used JD Break-in Plus oil. Once I hit 100 hrs, I then switched to JD 0W-40 full synthetic (mainly for easier cold weather starts).
 

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There's been a lot of discussion on when perform the first oil change on our 1023e/1025r/1026r/ so I was thinking when SHOULD we get that first oil change out of the way? Tractor Tim stated in one of his video's that he split the difference of 50 hrs/100hrs and got his done at 75. Some say do it at 50, others say wait till 200hrs. I'm putting 15w-40 JD oil that my dealer gave me when I bought the tractor. So what do you folks think?:unknown:
You won’t hurt your engine by changing the oil too often!

Having said that, the manual states 200 hrs.
It no longer mentions any of the confusion about break in oil, etc.

Tim
 

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Discussion Starter #4 (Edited)
Pulled the oil and filter after work last night and put in some fresh JD 15w-40. Figured I'd use non synthetic for the first one to give that little engine a chance to break in a little more while pushing snow/hauling wood/ect this winter then come spring I'll throw the synthetic to her! Thanks guys!
 

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There's been a lot of discussion on when perform the first oil change on our 1023e/1025r/1026r/ so I was thinking when SHOULD we get that first oil change out of the way? Tractor Tim stated in one of his video's that he split the difference of 50 hrs/100hrs and got his done at 75. Some say do it at 50, others say wait till 200hrs. I'm putting 15w-40 JD oil that my dealer gave me when I bought the tractor. So what do you folks think?:unknown:

Heh...those "others" include John Deere and Yanmar. Of course...John Deere also recommends John Deere filters, which are (notoriously) made by Fram, so....

So much voodoo surrounding oil and vehicle oil changes. I like reading Bob is the Oil Guy. He at least bring some degree of consistency to the argument.
 

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JD is what has been confusing to me... The manual will say one thing, Dealership another. In my personal vehicles I usually pull the oil out of it when its new at around 1500 miles then use whatever oil I'm planning on using from then on with absolutely no problems. And I hear ya on JD stuff. Most OEM stuff, autos and other machinery alike, is usually made by someone else. I work in a truck manufacturing factory and even tho our products have the company name on them there's usually a vendor involved.
 

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Heh...those "others" include John Deere and Yanmar. Of course...John Deere also recommends John Deere filters, which are (notoriously) made by Fram, so....

So much voodoo surrounding oil and vehicle oil changes. I like reading Bob is the Oil Guy. He at least bring some degree of consistency to the argument.
JD is what has been confusing to me... The manual will say one thing, Dealership another. In my personal vehicles I usually pull the oil out of it when its new at around 1500 miles then use whatever oil I'm planning on using from then on with absolutely no problems. And I hear ya on JD stuff. Most OEM stuff, autos and other machinery alike, is usually made by someone else. I work in a truck manufacturing factory and even tho our products have the company name on them there's usually a vendor involved.
 

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Pulled the oil and filter after work last night and put in some fresh JD 15w-40. Figured I'd use non synthetic for the first one to give that little engine a chance to break in a little more while pushing snow/hauling wood/ect this winter then come spring I'll throw the synthetic to her! Thanks guys!
That will work!!!

The oil change saga has been discussed Ad nauseam on this forum. That said, as Jgayman said, the operators manual has never said to change the engine oil at 50 hours, it has always been 200 hours or annually, which ever is less. It was the optional technical manual that mentioned the infamous "break-in oil" in the engine and this manual said to run the break-in oil for 100 hours.

This optional technical manual also mentions that ALL new and rebuilt engines are delivered with break-in oil. I question this statement, but even if it is true, it is irrelevant because even the technical manual says to use JD Plus 50 after the break-in period.

Also, it must be said, this chart that is in the JD Technical Manual also lists CC, CD and CE oils to be used if break-in oil is not available. FYI....these classifications of oil have been obsolete for years. My point, this info in the technical manual must be read in context. It simply says, new or rebuilt engines are delivered with break-in oil and after break-in (100 hours), refill with Plus 50.

So, does your engine have to have break-in oil in it after you get the tractor, unequivocally no!! There isn't an engine built in the last 10 years that is not broken in when it is put in the vehicle. They are run on a dyno and broken in there before they are ever installed in the vehicle.

And....just how long does it take to break-in an engine, about 1/2 hour of running, that's it. There has been, and still is, a serious misunderstanding of what "breaking-in" an engine actually means. It never has been and still isn't about breaking in piston rings, it is about breaking in the camshaft and lifters/followers if the engine has flat tappet lifters, and breaking in the camshaft and lifter/followers happens in the first 1/2 hour of running after assembly. If the engine has roller lifters, then break-in of the camshaft is not needed. This is the reason for assembly lube of break-in oil. The assembly lube of break-in oil has a zinc additive in it which provides a zinc coating on the camshaft lobes.

So, does the Yanmar engines used in the 1025R have flat tappet or roller lifter camshaft followers. They have flat tappet, so they did need to be broken in, but this is done in the first 1/2 hour of running on the dyno.

So, fill it up and keep it full of good quality oil of the correct viscosity and you will be fine. Engine problems are rare in today's engine world and when they do happen, it is rarely due to incorrect lubrication, albeit, it could have been caused by lack of lubrication. :thumbup1gif:
 

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Discussion Starter #9
That will work!!!

The oil change saga has been discussed Ad nauseam on this forum. That said, as Jgayman said, the operators manual has never said to change the engine oil at 50 hours, it has always been 200 hours or annually, which ever is less. It was the optional technical manual that mentioned the infamous "break-in oil" in the engine and this manual said to run the break-in oil for 100 hours.

This optional technical manual also mentions that ALL new and rebuilt engines are delivered with break-in oil. I question this statement, but even if it is true, it is irrelevant because even the technical manual says to use JD Plus 50 after the break-in period.

Also, it must be said, this chart that is in the JD Technical Manual also lists CC, CD and CE oils to be used if break-in oil is not available. FYI....these classifications of oil have been obsolete for years. My point, this info in the technical manual must be read in context. It simply says, new or rebuilt engines are delivered with break-in oil and after break-in (100 hours), refill with Plus 50.

So, does your engine have to have break-in oil in it after you get the tractor, unequivocally no!! There isn't an engine built in the last 10 years that is not broken in when it is put in the vehicle. They are run on a dyno and broken in there before they are ever installed in the vehicle.

And....just how long does it take to break-in an engine, about 1/2 hour of running, that's it. There has been, and still is, a serious misunderstanding of what "breaking-in" an engine actually means. It never has been and still isn't about breaking in piston rings, it is about breaking in the camshaft and lifters/followers if the engine has flat tappet lifters, and breaking in the camshaft and lifter/followers happens in the first 1/2 hour of running after assembly. If the engine has roller lifters, then break-in of the camshaft is not needed. This is the reason for assembly lube of break-in oil. The assembly lube of break-in oil has a zinc additive in it which provides a zinc coating on the camshaft lobes.

So, does the Yanmar engines used in the 1025R have flat tappet or roller lifter camshaft followers. They have flat tappet, so they did need to be broken in, but this is done in the first 1/2 hour of running on the dyno.

So, fill it up and keep it full of good quality oil of the correct viscosity and you will be fine. Engine problems are rare in today's engine world and when they do happen, it is rarely due to incorrect lubrication, albeit, it could have been caused by lack of lubrication. :thumbup1gif:
My thoughts exactly.When our truck is built, it comes off the assembly line straight onto the dyno where the engine is run up to operating temperature under a load and several other engine checks are performed. This is the first newer small diesel I've ever owned and between the owners manual, dealer, being OCD and YouTube stuff I wanted to make sure! I really appreciate all the feed back!:confused:
 

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The owners manual that I got with mine never mentions changing the oil annually, only at 200 hours. Copywrite date of 2017. At my estimated hours of around 50 per year, I'm not waiting four years to do my first oil change. That just makes my mind cringe. Especially when you consider tractors operate in such dusty environments. I think changing oil and filter anually just makes sense to me.
 

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JD is what has been confusing to me... The manual will say one thing, Dealership another. In my personal vehicles I usually pull the oil out of it when its new at around 1500 miles then use whatever oil I'm planning on using from then on with absolutely no problems. And I hear ya on JD stuff. Most OEM stuff, autos and other machinery alike, is usually made by someone else. I work in a truck manufacturing factory and even tho our products have the company name on them there's usually a vendor involved.
But...why do you do that? Break-in oil change at 1500 miles is not currently recommended by any vehicle mfgr that I know of and hasn't been for more than a decade.

As to OEM equipment, Based on objective testing, Fram is a notoriously terrible oil filter and unfortunately they do much of the OEM work. Again...Bob is the Oil Guy's website is pretty illuminating, but it's interesting to see the number of people that will argue current oil change concepts using modern lubricating oils, and do so based only on what the owner's manual of their car 15 years ago said, or what their pappy told 'em when they were a young'n.
 

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The owners manual that I got with mine never mentions changing the oil annually, only at 200 hours. Copywrite date of 2017. At my estimated hours of around 50 per year, I'm not waiting four years to do my first oil change. That just makes my mind cringe. Especially when you consider tractors operate in such dusty environments. I think changing oil and filter annually just makes sense to me.
I agree. I use my little SCUT year around for several things so I plan on changing mine every spring starting next year.
 

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The owners manual that I got with mine never mentions changing the oil annually, only at 200 hours. Copywrite date of 2017. At my estimated hours of around 50 per year, I'm not waiting four years to do my first oil change. That just makes my mind cringe. Especially when you consider tractors operate in such dusty environments. I think changing oil and filter anually just makes sense to me.
I guarantee that your manual lists an annual engine oil/filter change as does every SCUT/CUT Owner's Manual. I can't check the current 1-series manual because at the moment there is an issue with the JD website which causes the current manual to be unavailable. The text below comes from the previous manual but they are all the same in this regard.

Under the section of "Service Intervals" you will find listings for various numbers of hours. But there will also be a separate listing labeled "Annually" (new 2-series calls it YEARLY) under which it will have the following items:

[h=3]Annually[/h]
  • Clean radiator and oil cooler fins.
  • Check radiator coolant freeze point and clarity of coolant. See your John Deere Dealer for service, or to order a John Deere Coolant Test Kit.
  • Check and service air filter elements.
  • Change engine oil and filter if less than 200 hours of operation.
  • Drain water from fuel tank and replace fuel filters.
  • Check all hoses and clamps.
  • Check battery electrolyte level.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
But...why do you do that? Break-in oil change at 1500 miles is not currently recommended by any vehicle mfgr that I know of and hasn't been for more than a decade.

As to OEM equipment, Based on objective testing, Fram is a notoriously terrible oil filter and unfortunately they do much of the OEM work. Again...Bob is the Oil Guy's website is pretty illuminating, but it's interesting to see the number of people that will argue current oil change concepts using modern lubricating oils, and do so based only on what the owner's manual of their car 15 years ago said, or what their pappy told 'em when they were a young'n.
Well... the reason I pull that oil out is somewhat because of old habits I must admit. I used to work at a GM Dealership a loooonnngggg time ago and even tho lubrication has defiantly came a long way since then I like to get the original oil out along with the the crud from the break in process. And there is crud as we all know from the screens in our SCUTS. Don't figure anything mechanical has ever burnt up from to much grease/oil. LOL
 

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Well... the reason I pull that oil out is somewhat because of old habits I must admit. I used to work at a GM Dealership a loooonnngggg time ago and even tho lubrication has defiantly came a long way since then I like to get the original oil out along with the the crud from the break in process. And there is crud as we all know from the screens in our SCUTS. Don't figure anything mechanical has ever burnt up from to much grease/oil. LOL
As Tim said, there is no penalty for changing the oil/filter MORE than the mfgr recommends, with the exception of the cost of oil/filter and the time it takes to change it. Probably better to change it too often rather than not often enough.
 

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As Tim said, there is no penalty for changing the oil/filter MORE than the mfgr recommends, with the exception of the cost of oil/filter and the time it takes to change it. Probably better to change it too often rather than not often enough.
I definitely agree!!!
BTW great discussion!!
 

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I guarantee that your manual lists an annual engine oil/filter change as does every SCUT/CUT Owner's Manual. I can't check the current 1-series manual because at the moment there is an issue with the JD website which causes the current manual to be unavailable. The text below comes from the previous manual but they are all the same in this regard.

Under the section of "Service Intervals" you will find listings for various numbers of hours. But there will also be a separate listing labeled "Annually" (new 2-series calls it YEARLY) under which it will have the following items:

[h=3]Annually[/h]
  • Clean radiator and oil cooler fins.
  • Check radiator coolant freeze point and clarity of coolant. See your John Deere Dealer for service, or to order a John Deere Coolant Test Kit.
  • Check and service air filter elements.
  • Change engine oil and filter if less than 200 hours of operation.
  • Drain water from fuel tank and replace fuel filters.
  • Check all hoses and clamps.
  • Check battery electrolyte level.
I have to disagree about what my manual says. I have read it cover to cover countless times. Never one mention of changing oil annually. However if someone can direct me to the page number where is says it, I will eat crow if proven wrong.

Regarding to the list you show. Mine does NOT show under annually: Change oil and filter, check hoses and clamps or check battery level. In my manual the chart is on page 200-1 and 200-2
 

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I have to disagree about what my manual says. I have read it cover to cover countless times. Never one mention of changing oil annually. However if someone can direct me to the page number where is says it, I will eat crow if proven wrong.

Regarding to the list you show. Mine does NOT show under annually: Change oil and filter, check hoses and clamps or check battery level. In my manual the chart is on page 200-1 and 200-2
What is the date on your manual? Like I mentioned, there is a problem with the JD website current that prohibits accessing the most recent 1-series manual so I can only go by what is in the manuals from 2011 to 2016 or so.

Does your manual just list maintenance interval requirements in text or does it also have charts/tables? Just asking as JD has changed the format on their manuals over the years - I presume to introduce confusion factor for the owners. :)
 

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Pages out of mine.


Page 200-1


Page 200-2
Interesting... what is the copyright date at the bottom of the page where those charts appear?
 
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