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Discussion Starter #1
hello,
We have had a ton of snow the last few days so I have been out moving a bunch of it. Everything was fine until today. Seems like the joystick wants to center itself a little to the right, which un curls the bucket. If you pull it left (to curl the bucket up) eventually it will stop uncurling the bucket and keep it in what ever position you are in. Part in parcel with this is that the joystick wont pull very far left to curl the bucket up. Seem like you can push the joystick to the right and it uncurls the bucket at a normal rate, however pulling the stick left (barely moves left) and then it barely curls the bucket up. At idle it wont even curl the bucket up (which it used to do). I have to be north of 2500 rmp for the curling to even happen, which is at a very very slow speed. I've pulled the rubber boot up, nothing seems to be loose or disconnected, no leaks, hydraulic fluid is normal. The lock out pin is all the way out (or is it in?) so that the joystick is free to move. Drive power is normal. I dont get any bucket drop before the curl like other posts have mentioned. Any thoughts or ideas? Seems like something is stuck in the SCV valve not allowing the joystick to move to the left far enough. is this possible? I have ~ 150 hrs on this tractor (1st owner).
thank you in advance!
T
 

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Try disconnecting your hose couplers and reconnecting them. Might try swapping them so bucket and lift functions are reversed.
 

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Welcome to GTT,

In addition to what greenharly suggested (especially unplugging, cleaning and then re-plugging the couplers), have you lubricated the SCV linkage under the rubber boot?
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Welcome to GTT,

In addition to what greenharly suggested (especially unplugging, cleaning and then re-plugging the couplers), have you lubricated the SCV linkage under the rubber boot?
Just pulled the quick couplers off, cleaned them, reversed the hoses for curl up/curl down. Now I get a regular curl up, but slow curl down. I also lubed the SCV linkage under the boot, but there is still a very short movement pulling the lever to the left (to curl up normally). I slid the lock out pin in and out after lubing, its moving the way it should (not half stuck).

Any other thoughts?
Thank you in advance!!
T
 

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Hate to say it but might be a failure in the valve keeping the handle from going left (and you mention that it doesn't center itself, but "centers" to the right) . There shouldn't be any real resistance in the lever in any of the 4 directions, except the float (forward) and re-gen (right)...and those are more like a stop you have to push past versus resistance.

Here's a picture from the JD parts catalog showing the internals. Might be able to get an idea of what is happening inside the valve. Looks like this valve is used for all years of the 1025R.

View attachment 563825
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Video of whats going on...


Here is a short video of the joystick, I think something is shot with the valve. Has anyone had one of these apart? is there anything to do internally that might fix the issue? Or not?
thank you again for all the ideas!
 

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Discussion Starter #7 (Edited)
Do you know what part # this is?? (Pics and video)

Hello,
Trying to diagnose an issue with my SCV valve on 1025R. Dealer told me I need to buy entire valve, parts guys says these parts are available separately, but nothing denotes which is which in the diagram. I'm trying to figure out what parts in the image correspond to the part name and remarks (blue and red arrow), as I'm pretty certain its causing the issues Im experiencing with the bucket not curling up and joystick falling to the right side on its own causing bucket to uncurl. I think the part I need is described as "Regen centering x20 SCV", which Im hoping is the part being pointed to with the red arrow. The curl/uncurl hydraulic circuit is associated with the ports denoted by the green arrows, which is why Im thinking that the part being pointed to by the red arrow is the culprit.

Has anyone ever replaced either of these bottom looking tubes (red and blue arrows) on bottom of valve. After talking to JD tech they described them as the detent sections of the valve.
Here is a video of what my valve is doing. Seems like a spring is shot allowing the joystick to fall to the right with little to no force applied (and also not re-centering). Possibly something stuck, not allowing you to pull joystick left to have bucket curl up.

Parts link: http://jdpc.deere.com/jdpc/servlet/com.deere.u90490.partscatalog.view.servlets.HomePa geServlet_Alt?wvsessionid=cd61738c15014d68a479d510 a2188599

Video showing exactly whats happening with valve:

Image of the valve:
SCV Valve annotated.jpg

Any thoughts?
Thanks again
 

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I can't totally answer your question but can provide a little info.

Normally when they talk about the detent kit or section of the valve they are talking about the detent where the float function is. So normally machines are set up so that your lift control for the arms or a blade on a quick hitch on the front has a float mode. I want to say on your machine you push it forward a little harder than normal and it will click and lock forward so that the FEL, blade or blower follows the contours of the ground. This detent kit can be added to the other hydraulic control. Some people do this on a FEL so that they can push it all the way over in the dump mode so a full bucket can dump quicker with gravity kind of like the old trip buckets rather than waiting on hydraulics to cycle.

I am not familiar with the names of the other kits but one would be the normal operation from the factory and I can't say for sure what is included in the kit to know if it comes with a spring or whatever is causing your issue.

Not sure that this helps other than explaining what they are likely talking about with the detent kit.
 

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I commend your willingness to make this repair yourself.

If it were me, I would first have a thorough visual examination of the external linkage to make damn sure it was not responsible for a loss of valve stroke before I started taking things off the machine.

Next I would recommend dismantling the valve body and looking for things like broken re-centering springs. Find what is required such as the faulty part, o-rings or gaskets that you may need for a professional valve body renewal, and then compile your parts order.

From the looks of that parts diagram, they are no way showing all the pieces utilized in the assembly. It may well be that some are only included as an assembly (which sucks). The lack of distinct, individual part numbers is hindrance enough.

Good luck man, and please keep us posted!
 

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First off, you shouldn't have started another thread. It's easier for everyone to read the posts involved in one place and not have to jump from thread to thread. Not complaining, just saying.

Jeff B beat me to the punch....looks like dismantling the valve is going to be the way to go to find out what's going on inside. From your video it doesn't look like any external interference (I could be wrong). The parts list & diagram doesn't appear to be showing everything, and like he said, some things may only be available in a complete valve assembly. If you tear it apart and find something, I'd suggest contacting JD Tech and see if what you need is available separately and what the part numbers are, for sure.

If it were me, after making 100% sure the problem isn't external (and again, it doesn't appear to be), I'd be thinking I'd have to replace the valve, so what do I have to lose by opening it up and checking the parts inside. Might get lucky and be able to repair it. But I'm not there looking at the valve so I can only theorize and speculate.

We are very curious about your findings and fix. PLEASE keep us posted and updated. :munch:
 

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I watched your video and have a question...... Are you absolutely SURE you SCV lock is FULLY out?


The reason I ask is, I can duplicate the exact same travel limits on my 1025r by holding the lock just a tiny bit in. The up/down/dump will work fine, but the curl back is limited to about an inch of travel.... With the lock fully out, the curl travel is about 3 inches at the knob.

Might be something to check out again before diving into an $800 hydraulic valve...

Good luck!
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Thank you for all your suggestions. Sorry for the double post, I should have added to the other one (i'll know better next time). I will double check again the lock out isn't slightly engaged. I've lubed everything and seems to be sliding fully, but i will triple check that for sure. Other reason I think its the valve or what ever the cylinder is at the base of the valve is that the joystick will not center itself and likes to drift right and uncurl the bucket on its own. Im hoping there is a spring in there that is stopping the valve being pushed down (left on the stick) and pushing it up (right on the stick) as that seems to be whats happening.

I agree with you KyleW, why not pull it apart at this point. I'll either find something to fix or the valve is shot anyways.
I'll let you know what I find. Im still in plastic removal stage to get to the valve!! What a PITA!
thanks everyone
T
 

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I agree with you KyleW, why not pull it apart at this point. I'll either find something to fix or the valve is shot anyways.
I'll let you know what I find. Im still in plastic removal stage to get to the valve!! What a PITA!
thanks everyone
T
I have fixed a lot of stuff that way. If nothing else it was broke anyhow. Or you get in further and see what is going on. As I mentioned there are the detent kits that can be added so it is designed to come apart. They just don't diagram it all out.
 

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I had a similar problem on one of my backhoe valves. Please see this post. There's a spring assembly that you access from the bottom of the valve. We could not see anything wrong with it when we took it out, but it was different from the new one that we put in. As I note in the post, they don't call it a spring assembly in the parts diagram and that made it harder to diagnose the problem.

Keane
 

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Discussion Starter #15 (Edited)
Hello All,

Good NEWS! Problem Solved with no cash spent thankfully :yahoo:. 3 Local JD dealers told me to just buy a new valve (good for their bottom line, but not my pocket book) and apparently the tech line had 'never' heard of this issue before. Yeah Right!

So the 'cylinders' on the bottom of the valve are basically just covers (they do hold the spring assembly (not sure if that's the right terminology or not) in place also). Anyways, knowing what I do now I'm pretty sure I could have fixed it with out disassembling half the tractor to get the valves out (Id try that first!), but I didn't before I started, so now I have a pile of plastic in my bucket.

rotated IMG_8049.jpg

I needed to get the right fender cover off to get to the valve, so start by removing the right rear tire, take the floor boards out, and to do that you must remove the green engine side panels, the lower half of the housing around the operators column (just below where parking brake is), and the panel under the seat which has the knob for your mid mount mower height adjustment (pull straight up on the knob and it will pop off. You also need to loosen the set screw and remove the handle to adjust the speed your hydraulics (right between your feet sitting in the seat) and dont forget the knob on the lock out for the SCV valve (easily unthreads). I used 2' wide masking tape to tape up the bolts/washers and label them (using the parts diagram from JD parts online site that I printed as I didn't want to break any plastic) and I did this job over a few evenings and I know I'll forget where all these fasteners go when I go to reassemble.

Disconnect quick couplers to front end loader to limit amount of fluid you lose (not sure how much will come out as its not under pressure, but I thought this was a good idea? Loosen all the hydraulic connections to the valve (3/4" wrench), then 3 bolts that attach valve to tractor (13mm), otherwise risk tweaking a hydraulic hard lines. Valve is now off, take to the bench. You will lose a small amount of fluid, so put a catch pan under valve. Tip valve around to drain fluid into pan so you don't get a surprise all over your bench when you turn it over or move it around.

Its a metric allan key to remove the 2 screws holding the cylinder/cover (basically a cap) to base of valve assembly (5 mm maybe, I cant remember exactly, but its metric). Remove those. Slide cover off.
You get this....

bottom screw location.jpg

There is an allan headed bolt inside spring assembly (red arrow) that basically backed itself out, which was causing all my problems. The reason the joystick wanted to flop over to the right (uncurling the bucket on its own) was because the spring didn't have any pre-load on it to recenter the joystick, and I couldn't pull the joystick left to curl bucket up, because the 1/4" or 1/2" of space (I dont actually know what the measurement is) from the bottom of the spring collar? (silver piece inside bottom of spring) to the end of the cylinder cap (Black cover) was being occupied by the spring being backed off (so no where for the valve body to drop down into essentially. The screw was only in place by half a thread then I took the cap off. I tightened it back up, put the cover back on and bingo bango, all is back to normal. I then disassembled it again, cleaned up the grease on the threads of the bolt only, added a drop of blue locktite, and reassembled the spring assembly, and cover again. I have no idea why that bolt would back out (hydraulic vibration Im thinking?). Anyhow, I hope that helps someone else out and saves them $1200 (CAN) plus tax on a new valve assembly. I would have ordered from US if I needed it as its still expensive that way, but not as bad as local dealers (we get hosed up here on everything- I know, smaller market yada yada).

Like I said, knowing this is the issue, you can probably do this repair by just removing the rear right tire, get a good light under there and work from under the tractor. Hardest part is putting upward pressure on the spring assembly to start the bolt (you might be on an angle working under tractor, would be easier on the bench, but a good hour or more of plastic removal!).

Note: It seems like when you are tightening that bolt you get a slight resistance like its tight, but its the shoulder on the bolt (where the thread ends and the shank starts) passing through the ball bearings up inside (you can see them with the bolt and spring removed). Keep turning till it seats up in there and is tight. I don't know for sure, but I think those are the detents for the dump position (far right push on the joystick).

Tonight I will be reassembling entire tractor it seems, topping up hydraulic fluids and giving it a test drive and working out the air in the system.

Only good thing about having all the plastic off and floorboards is that all those hard to get to grease nipples on the U-joints under the floorboards are right out in the open, so give your tractor a REAL easy grease job before you put it all back together, and oil change if you need to its so wide open. Basically looks like a wrecked vehicle at this point! Got the valve reinstalled last night and this is how she sits. 2-3 beers tonight and she will be back together!

wrecked vehicle.jpg

I really appreciate all the help and ideas I get from these forums, I hope this helps someone else down the road.
:cheers:

Here is a few other pics along the way
IMG_8046.jpg
IMG_8044.jpg
 

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I'm glad everything worked out OK for you!!! Good to see that it was a fairly simple fix even if it involved a lot of plastic removal...

Thanks for posting your findings.
 

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Great follow up thanks! :good2:

I merged the threads so as to help anyone in the future with this issue.
 

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Awesome ! :good2: Awesome ! :yahoo: Awesome ! :bigthumb:

Fantastic the repair only cost you a few beers...and you got to be the recipient of those too ! What a deal :drinks:

Great write up on your findings too. Glad you put loc-tite on the culprit bolt. Hope you never have that problem again.

Thanks for the info.
 

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Thanks for the detailed write up, I tucked this one away in case it happens to me. Thanks for sharing

Jason


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