[TwoAcherFarm]

A week ago I mowed with the 60D with no issues that I know about. Since then pried some stumps out with FEL, bucket, pallet forks. Then tilled the ex-stump area with no issues that I know about. Yesterday I pulled the FEL and connected the 60D but no spin on the blades.
Pulled the 60D and checked the output shafts. With B or R selected the PTO indicates correct speed and rear PTO output spins. When shut down I cannot turn the rear PTO by hand in these positions which is what I expected. With M or B selected the PTO indicates correct speed but mid PTO output does not spin. When shut down I can easily turn the mid PTO by hand in these positions which is not what I expected. I thought maybe electrical, maybe roots or sticks knocked some wiring loose, but there is only one PTO solenoid as far as I can tell and since the rear PTO works fine and the PTO speed indicates correct for rear or mid PTO I think now that rules out electrical. The PTO selector is fastened right to the shaft on the box so I don't think anything could have hit that and knocked out any adjustment. The PTO selector feels like it locks in M-B-R detents normally. I am getting the ugly (a.k.a. expensive) feeling that something inside the selector mechanism has broken or come loose.
I didn't find this issue in search so I'm wondering if anyone else has run into this? Have I dimwittedly missed something obvious?

 

[4056982fly]

If it’s got the command cut dial and it’s on zero or thinks it is, it doesn’t let the mid pto engage.


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[TwoAcherFarm]

If it’s got the command cut dial and it’s on zero or thinks it is, it doesn’t let the mid pto engage.


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My tractor and 60D are year 2014 so Command Cut isn't on there ( I think that came out in about 2016). Great idea though.
Dealer service is backed up 2 weeks so no mowing the grass. Well, not with the 60D anyway. I can resort to the brush hog, that should make the lawn look nice! I used to use that when we first built since we were measuring the grass in feet then. If I don't mow in a couple weeks it'll be back to feet deep!

 

[ClydeLogan]

Are you on or out of the seat while performing these tests to see which PTO shaft is spinning?

 

[TwoAcherFarm]

I can see the rear output from the seat but have to pull and jump the weight sensor under the seat so I can get down to see the mid output shaft. Actually it has proven easier to do it all off the seat with the weight sensor jumped. Seems so strange in B to see the rear output spin and the mid just sit there. That's what makes me think it is not electrical.
Have been staring at 644 pages of tech manual but not getting any brilliant clues yet. Except that I don't want to be trying to take the PTO housing apart.

 

[MarkEagleUSA]

There is no command cut on a 1025R. There is a rotary deck height knob down to the left of the seat but it has no effect on the PTO.

 

[kylew]

Except that I don't want to be trying to take the PTO housing apart.

<gulp> It doesn't sound good, and does sound like an internal failure. If you can manually spin the mid-PTO by hand with it engaged in M or B, somethings amiss inside. The lever physically makes the gears engage in any of the 3 positions. The only electrical is the solenoid and the MBR switch. The switch only tells the ICC of its in R or not, and the solenoid only starts/stops the PTO. Sounds like you eliminated both of those.

Honestly, I wouldn't run the PTO at all until you figure out what the problem is. Running the rear only may lead to more, expensive damage.

 

[SulleyBear]

Here is the selector pawl shown as number 17, which selects the mid or rear PTO shaft output. The end of the PTO lever fits into the threaded portion of number 17, just outside of where the O ring is located.

I would check and make sure the PTO lever is connected to the selector pawl, which it likely is. If the lever is moving and attached to the shifter pawl, then something inside is broken. But I would want to make sure the lock nut on the lever is attached to the lever and tight to the shifter pawl, so the collar is actually sliding and making the selection from the front to the rear PTO shafts.

Beyond that, its going to be an internal repair.

For some reason, I couldn't post a screen shot, but here is a link to the page in the parts book. Please make sure to let us know what you find out is the issue..........Thanks.

https://partscatalog.deere.com/jdrc/sidebyside/equipment/61723/referrer/search/pgId/208962927

 

[TwoAcherFarm]

Welllll...the brush hog plan just crapped out. Carried a new small tree out to plant today, did a little ground work with the bucket, and the range selector got balkier than usual trying to go from L to N then H. But it went after some wrangling then when I went to park it is stuck solidly in H. In and out of 4WD no change. Up hills, down hills, bouncy ground, still stuck in H. "Sumthin ain't right" in there. So I got it in the garage and there it's stuck since I can't start without getting to N (or bypassing the safety). My excuse for grass is just gonna have to grow till the shop has time to work on it. Starting to wonder if something shattered and little bits are jamming things. Better to sit than damage anything more. Bleaghhhh.

 

[kylew]

Better to sit than damage anything more.

Agreed. It's one thing to have to throw a few hundred dollars at it to fix what ails it now. It's another to have to throw a few thousand dollars at it because the housing/case suffered irreparable damage also (not to say it hasn't already happened... just trying to be optimistic). Better to cut your losses now.

 

[TwoAcherFarm]

Agreed. It's one thing to have to throw a few hundred dollars at it to fix what ails it now. It's another to have to throw a few thousand dollars at it because the housing/case suffered irreparable damage also (not to say it hasn't already happened... just trying to be optimistic). Better to cut your losses now.

Thanks. An entire tranny assembly lists at 5900. But the filter is supposed to keep it from pumping bits all through everything so I'm hanging on to the idea of local sloshing moving chunks around. Dealer will have to drag it out of garage somehow to take it in. Should get some idea in about two weeks. No used stuff (except 7 series Ag) on the lot so I can't even try to rent something.

 

[TwoAcherFarm]

Well THAT took forever and a few more days! But finally the dealer cracked the tranny and says they found a snap ring and a gear lying in the bottom. They figure the snap ring came off then that allowed the gear to work off and that allowed the mid-PTO to spin free. The loose parts apparently jammed the range shift. They put the gear back on, put the snap ring back in place, and tell me everything works perfectly now. It's reassembled and working its way back to me as it had moved to one of their other sites due to technician shortage. They had no explanation for how a snap ring in the tranny comes off but did agree it was pretty strange. 2014 machine so it will be some labor hours and replacement hydro juice. If I get better details of which snap ring and which gear when I get the bill I'll come back and post. PITA to be out of a machine for two months (harvest season and I agree AG machines must be fixed first) but the good news is I didn't trash a bunch of parts. Sheesh.

 

[kylew]

All in all that is good news. Could have been at worse for sure. Would love to see which ring it was that was the culprit.

 

[SulleyBear]

Also interested in the total bill amount, if you don't mind sharing. Specifically, Curios the number of labor hours, etc.

Since the machine is a 2014, I Will say, this is the first internal "failure" of one of these rear end assemblies I can recall. I sure hope they used a new snap ring and checked the seats in the groove on the shaft, etc. to make sure it was properly seated.

Recall there was an issue with a few of the 3ph assemblies where the wrong snap rings were used and they came off and permitted the shaft to slide to one side and the 3ph arm on the affected side not function. The snap ring was to thin and allowed it to move slightly in the shaft groove and eventually, worked out of position. The solution was to measure the snap rings and replace with one of the right thickness which correctly seated in the machined groove on the shaft.

Since your machine is 7 years old, it would seem if this were an assembly issue, we would have heard of another incident with the rear case, but I can't recall any................Glad your tractor is on the mend..........and hopefully home soon.......

Thank you for posting the follow up to your issue, This is IMMENSELY helpful to the website / thread........especially since this seems to be a rare incident......

 

[theduke]

I'm guessing you got a "new" snap ring.....seems logical they'd replace that part.

 

[TwoAcherFarm]

Item #4 snap ring N172671 came off which allowed item #25 gear LVU21833 to fall off the mid-PTO pinion #32 LVU21987. Gear and snap ring checked ok with square edges. Put gear and snap ring on but ring would not seat. Used brass hammer to tap bearing #8 LVA16476 and they saw it move up and seat. Put gear and snap ring back on and it fit perfectly. So $177 in seals, o-rings, hydrojuice, and a few other bits plus $1110 in labor (no hours listed) the tractor is cleaner than since I got it (I have no idea how they get in some of those places to clean, hose and pressure washer don't do it for me) and is operating smoother than ever as far as I can tell.
So which came first, shaft moved and caused the snap ring to come off, or snap ring came off and shaft moved as gear worked off? I would have to think the snap ring went first but nobody has a clue how or why.
Funny SullyB mentioned the 3ph shaft snapring. I had the left side of the 60D drop a year ago and took a while to figure the shaft went way right and the lift arm dropped due to a missing snap ring. At least I could move the shaft back and put a new snap ring on it myself. No way was I going to try to disassemble the entire rear half of the tractor to get the tranny out and then take that thing apart. A man has got to know his limitations.
Anyway, Johnny and I have two months of fall work backed up to do in about two weeks...............

 

[SulleyBear]

Item #4 snap ring N172671 came off which allowed item #25 gear LVU21833 to fall off the mid-PTO pinion #32 LVU21987. Gear and snap ring checked ok with square edges. Put gear and snap ring on but ring would not seat. Used brass hammer to tap bearing #8 LVA16476 and they saw it move up and seat. Put gear and snap ring back on and it fit perfectly. So $177 in seals, o-rings, hydrojuice, and a few other bits plus $1110 in labor (no hours listed) the tractor is cleaner than since I got it (I have no idea how they get in some of those places to clean, hose and pressure washer don't do it for me) and is operating smoother than ever as far as I can tell.
So which came first, shaft moved and caused the snap ring to come off, or snap ring came off and shaft moved as gear worked off? I would have to think the snap ring went first but nobody has a clue how or why.
Funny SullyB mentioned the 3ph shaft snapring. I had the left side of the 60D drop a year ago and took a while to figure the shaft went way right and the lift arm dropped due to a missing snap ring. At least I could move the shaft back and put a new snap ring on it myself. No way was I going to try to disassemble the entire rear half of the tractor to get the tranny out and then take that thing apart. A man has got to know his limitations.
Anyway, Johnny and I have two months of fall work backed up to do in about two weeks...............

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Thank you for posting the follow up. It's nice to have a conclusion to threads, especially those threads which are for issues which aren't commonly encountered. Sounds like a fluke and glad they were able to repair the machine and get it back to you.

I would guess the labor totaled about 10 hours at $110 per hour and the parts price seems in line as well for the work done. Hope you and your tractor get your work completed before winter sets in.

While I don't recall hearing of any similar issues with anyone on this site in the last several years with their 1 series tractor, should it happen to someone else and they have the same operational challenges you experienced with your machine, your thread post and sharing the resolution will prove to be very helpful to others.

Thanks for taking the time and posting the specific conclusion and the costs. It really helps complete the entire matter.