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Was blowing snow today with my 1025R tractor when all of a sudden it started to mis and give off some black exhaust. Got it back to town picked up 2 fuel filters and procedded to fix the problem. Wrong new parts, good fuel flow, no air obstruction, and no throttle. Any ideas on what else it could be.
 

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Maybe the Air Filter plugging up with Snow? That has been known to happen on some GM Diesel Pick-up trucks from certain years. I would inspect the Air Filter and see if it is wet or if the inside of the housing is wet. Otherwise, it might be in the injector pump if the throttle linkage is still connected.
 

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Was blowing snow today with my 1025R tractor when all of a sudden it started to mis and give off some black exhaust. Got it back to town picked up 2 fuel filters and procedded to fix the problem. Wrong new parts, good fuel flow, no air obstruction, and no throttle. Any ideas on what else it could be.
Possibly fuel gelling. Do you treat your fuel in the winter?
 

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Guessing fuel gel,,, treat your fuel..

Also the baby filter under the left side is the one I had to change a couple of years ago when fuel started to gel.

And on a side note.

Don't Over Treat your fuel. , it can cause the same effects but fuel will not be gelled from water but like a wax in your fuel and clog your filter.
 

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Maybe the Air Filter plugging up with Snow? That has been known to happen on some GM Diesel Pick-up trucks from certain years. I would inspect the Air Filter and see if it is wet or if the inside of the housing is wet. Otherwise, it might be in the injector pump if the throttle linkage is still connected.
This would be my guess as well. But he does state there was no air obstruction so I would assume he checked the filter. We will have to wait and see with more info from the OP.
This is where that air restriction gauge the bean counters nixed would have shown the issue immediately if it was airflow lack caused by snow infiltration. The pic below is the one I installed on my 1025R. Got it off e-bay for under $20.


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Guessing fuel gel,,, treat your fuel..

Also the baby filter under the left side is the one I had to change a couple of years ago when fuel started to gel.

And on a side note.

Don't Over Treat your fuel. , it can cause the same effects but fuel will not be gelled from water but like a wax in your fuel and clog your filter.
Yes, and when treating fuel ensure it is not cold. Treatment will not work properly unless fuel is warm when mixing.

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Yes, and when treating fuel ensure it is not cold. Treatment will not work properly unless fuel is warm when mixing.

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Hope the OP comes back. Does not appear to post often. Welcome to GTT, hope we can help!!

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This would be my guess as well. But he does state there was no air obstruction so I would assume he checked the filter. We will have to wait and see with more info from the OP.
This is where that air restriction gauge the bean counters nixed would have shown the issue immediately if it was airflow lack caused by snow infiltration. The pic below is the one I installed on my 1025R. Got it off e-bay for under $20.


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I was lucky, my 1026R came with the restriction indicator, the fuel jelling could also be a possibility as mentioned. I have never had that happen on my tractor, though it did happen on my Pick-up Truck. I had a tank full summer fuel and needed to drive it during the winter and if jelled up bad. I only put 150 miles on the truck that year.
 

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If he had the old style of air filter mounting, it could have cracked the intake runner and ingested the fragments.
 

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Guessing fuel gel,,, treat your fuel..

Also the baby filter under the left side is the one I had to change a couple of years ago when fuel started to gel.

And on a side note.

Don't Over Treat your fuel. , it can cause the same effects but fuel will not be gelled from water but like a wax in your fuel and clog your filter.
If you over treat with a emulsifier product, it can cause the problems you describe. But one should really avoid ever using a emulsifier product as it forces the water to bind with the fuel and defeats the purpose of the filters. It also leads to water being "burned" in the combustion chamber, which is a bad idea for lots of reasons, primarily being the water is abrasive and also damaging to steel........

How do you know if you have an emulsifier product? It's very likely made with alcohol or an alcohol product which has a name that ends in "ol". If you use too much of an emulsifier product, you will cause all kinds of issues in the fuel system and none of them good................

The demulsifier products separate the water from the fuel and force it into the fuel separator and filters. Howes, Stanadyne, Royal Purple are very popular demulsifier products. Actually, you can't over treat with a demulsifier and it says so right on the bottle. Demulsifiers are the proper way to treat diesel fuel for use in cold weather climates to prevent fuel gelling, filter freeze, etc.

This product shown in the red bottle is NOT a fuel treatment product and does NOT prevent fuel filter freeze and separation. Its simply designed to force the fuel to flow through the filters and into the engine with the water bound to it. It will get the tractor running, but often at a very high cost in the long run as it is very hard on injector pumps, injectors, etc.
723361

Diesel 911 is a RESCUE PRODUCT. From their website....
Diesel 911 is a winter emergency use product. This Winter Rescue Formula reliquefies gelled fuel and de-ices frozen fuel-filters to restore the flow of diesel fuel to an engine. Diesel 911 does not prevent fuel gelling – use Diesel Fuel Supplement +Cetane Boost (in the white bottle) as a preventive measure to keep fuel from gelling. Diesel 911 and Diesel Fuel Supplement +Cetane Boost are compatible in diesel fuel and may be used at the same time.


When you are getting paraffin in your filters, its due to the "filter freeze" which causes the paraffin in the fuel to crystallize. Paraffin is the source of energy in the fuel and without it, or when it crystallizes or hardens and gets caught in the filters, the remaining fuel lacks the ability to produce power needed for the engine to run correctly. This can cause the engine to stumble, smoke and lack power.

You Have to make sure to keep all fuel treatments warm and to mix with all fuels ideally at 40 degrees or more. Always keep the fuel treatment products in a heated space and only add them to fuel when the temps are above freezing. Otherwise, the treatments won't blend and won't properly treat the fuel. This is why I like to buy all of the diesel for the winter on a fall day or warm winter day and treat all the fuel immediately as it is being put into the fuel jugs or storage tank.

Once properly treated, the fuel can be stored where it is cold and even below freezing without any problems.

The products which prevent fuel filter freeze and gelling (Howe's, Stanadyne, Royal Purple, etc), will actually freeze in their natural state at 32 degrees until blended with diesel fuel. Once blended, they work together to protect the fuel and properly lubricate the injector pump, etc.

While some products claim to treat both "Gas and Diesel fuels", you need to be very careful as usually those products are emulsifiers and NOT what you want in your diesel fuel.

The most popular fuel treatment for winter conditions used in gasoline powered vehicles is "Heet". They also make a red bottle product which they claim treats "both gasoline and diesel fuel" against moisture issues. Here is from their website..... This is NOT the product to use in diesel fuel as it is an emulsifier product.

723363


ISO-HEET® brand contains isopropanol and special gas additives including Fuel Injector Cleaner. When ISO-HEET® brand is added to the fuel tank, this formula remains in the solution with the gasoline, and absorbs five times more than regular gas-line antifreeze. Any water in the gas tank mixes with the ISO-HEET® brand, preventing the water from freezing in winter. ISO-HEET® brand also removes water and condensation in warm, wet weather. Then the entire mixture of gasoline, ISO-HEET® brand and water are burned during combustion inside the engine. ISO-HEET® brand cleans fuel injectors and carburetors for fast starts and smooth-running engines year round.

Fine for use in gasoline engines to prevent fuel problems in the winter, but I don't recommend ever using this in diesel fuel.

Ultra Low Sulfar Diesel lacks the lubricity to help prevent wear in the injector pumps and the injectors themselves. Adding a good diesel fuel treatment product (Howes, Stanadyne, Royal Purple, etc) is the best approach. While I use Lucas Fuel Treatment as a fuel system cleaner in my gasoline vehicles, I don't use it in diesel fuel as any product designed to work in gasoline usually contains an alcohol product, which is very corrosive and hard on fuel system parts.

Burning water in diesel engines = Hard on the engines
Burning alcohol products in diesel engines = Hard on injector pumps and injectors, plus causes cylinder wall wear and other premature engine wear.
 

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If he had the old style of air filter mounting, it could have cracked the intake runner and ingested the fragments.
Very true.......I thought the same thing. I hope he checks that before he goes too far, not that it will matter if the damage has occurred to the intake runner, it's new engine time...........
 

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Very true.......I thought the same thing. I hope he checks that before he goes too far, not that it will matter if the damage has occurred to the intake runner, it's new engine time...........
He was on today. Wrote 14 hours ago (about 10pm eastern on the second, and was on at 12:59 today, but no response here? I private messaged him that he had responses here too. Odd.

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Discussion Starter #15
We'll I made it back but haven't gotten any closer to a fix. I did have a tech come over from the dealer that I bought the tractor from. We started the tractor and of course it didn't heal itself over night like I was hoping. Checked the temps on the exhaust manifold and found 1 cyl was 40 degrees colder than the other 2. He then cracked the line going to that injector and the engine smoothed right out. Loaded onto trailer and went to the dealers, With only a 127 hours on the tractor at 5 years old, I'm hoping JD will help out on the cost. Tried all of the things suggested here on the chat line, last night.Thanks for them.
 

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If he had the old style of air filter mounting, it could have cracked the intake runner and ingested the fragments.
You beat me to it Martin, except I was only thinking a crack and not ingesting.
 

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If you over treat with a emulsifier product, it can cause the problems you describe. But one should really avoid ever using a emulsifier product as it forces the water to bind with the fuel and defeats the purpose of the filters. It also leads to water being "burned" in the combustion chamber, which is a bad idea for lots of reasons, primarily being the water is abrasive and also damaging to steel........

How do you know if you have an emulsifier product? It's very likely made with alcohol or an alcohol product which has a name that ends in "ol". If you use too much of an emulsifier product, you will cause all kinds of issues in the fuel system and none of them good................

The demulsifier products separate the water from the fuel and force it into the fuel separator and filters. Howes, Stanadyne, Royal Purple are very popular demulsifier products. Actually, you can't over treat with a demulsifier and it says so right on the bottle. Demulsifiers are the proper way to treat diesel fuel for use in cold weather climates to prevent fuel gelling, filter freeze, etc.

This product shown in the red bottle is NOT a fuel treatment product and does NOT prevent fuel filter freeze and separation. Its simply designed to force the fuel to flow through the filters and into the engine with the water bound to it. It will get the tractor running, but often at a very high cost in the long run as it is very hard on injector pumps, injectors, etc.
View attachment 723361
Diesel 911 is a RESCUE PRODUCT. From their website....
Diesel 911 is a winter emergency use product. This Winter Rescue Formula reliquefies gelled fuel and de-ices frozen fuel-filters to restore the flow of diesel fuel to an engine. Diesel 911 does not prevent fuel gelling – use Diesel Fuel Supplement +Cetane Boost (in the white bottle) as a preventive measure to keep fuel from gelling. Diesel 911 and Diesel Fuel Supplement +Cetane Boost are compatible in diesel fuel and may be used at the same time.


When you are getting paraffin in your filters, its due to the "filter freeze" which causes the paraffin in the fuel to crystallize. Paraffin is the source of energy in the fuel and without it, or when it crystallizes or hardens and gets caught in the filters, the remaining fuel lacks the ability to produce power needed for the engine to run correctly. This can cause the engine to stumble, smoke and lack power.

You Have to make sure to keep all fuel treatments warm and to mix with all fuels ideally at 40 degrees or more. Always keep the fuel treatment products in a heated space and only add them to fuel when the temps are above freezing. Otherwise, the treatments won't blend and won't properly treat the fuel. This is why I like to buy all of the diesel for the winter on a fall day or warm winter day and treat all the fuel immediately as it is being put into the fuel jugs or storage tank.

Once properly treated, the fuel can be stored where it is cold and even below freezing without any problems.

The products which prevent fuel filter freeze and gelling (Howe's, Stanadyne, Royal Purple, etc), will actually freeze in their natural state at 32 degrees until blended with diesel fuel. Once blended, they work together to protect the fuel and properly lubricate the injector pump, etc.

While some products claim to treat both "Gas and Diesel fuels", you need to be very careful as usually those products are emulsifiers and NOT what you want in your diesel fuel.

The most popular fuel treatment for winter conditions used in gasoline powered vehicles is "Heet". They also make a red bottle product which they claim treats "both gasoline and diesel fuel" against moisture issues. Here is from their website..... This is NOT the product to use in diesel fuel as it is an emulsifier product.

View attachment 723363


ISO-HEET® brand contains isopropanol and special gas additives including Fuel Injector Cleaner. When ISO-HEET® brand is added to the fuel tank, this formula remains in the solution with the gasoline, and absorbs five times more than regular gas-line antifreeze. Any water in the gas tank mixes with the ISO-HEET® brand, preventing the water from freezing in winter. ISO-HEET® brand also removes water and condensation in warm, wet weather. Then the entire mixture of gasoline, ISO-HEET® brand and water are burned during combustion inside the engine. ISO-HEET® brand cleans fuel injectors and carburetors for fast starts and smooth-running engines year round.

Fine for use in gasoline engines to prevent fuel problems in the winter, but I don't recommend ever using this in diesel fuel.

Ultra Low Sulfar Diesel lacks the lubricity to help prevent wear in the injector pumps and the injectors themselves. Adding a good diesel fuel treatment product (Howes, Stanadyne, Royal Purple, etc) is the best approach. While I use Lucas Fuel Treatment as a fuel system cleaner in my gasoline vehicles, I don't use it in diesel fuel as any product designed to work in gasoline usually contains an alcohol product, which is very corrosive and hard on fuel system parts.

Burning water in diesel engines = Hard on the engines
Burning alcohol products in diesel engines = Hard on injector pumps and injectors, plus causes cylinder wall wear and other premature engine wear.

Wow great post thanks for taking the time to post it good read!!
happy new year
 

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Discussion Starter #19
It is the old style and the tech said they would check and probably put the new style on.
Well it's been almost 2 weeks since my last post about the Throttle problem, and I've got real good news to pass on. Can't tell you what actually caused the problem, but it's been taken care of by Riester&Schnell in Pound, Wi. under warrenty, plus they did the Air Filter upgrade, thanks to JD. I'm supposed to be getting all of the paper work on what they did, so I'll pass that on when I get it. Just want to give a big THANK YOU to R&S . If your out and about in Wisconsin and need JD help, try Riester&Schnell. They got a bunch of shops out there.
 

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Looking forward to hear what they did to resolve the issue. Also, just in case you happened to have any spare air filters for your tractor at home, (such as a John Deere filter pack or individual filters) the new air filter system is shorter and the old filters won't fit in the new system. Most dealers will allow you to return the "old style" filters and get the shorter version for the updated system.

It sure is nice when a dealer steps up and takes care of the problem. Glad you are getting back the tractor repaired and not a big bill to go with it..........
 
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