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Alright, a few might’ve seen me commenting a few months ago about engine horsepower and how I believe that you should always go with the strongest engine in a given frame size. An old wives tale has always floated around saying that you’ll run out of traction way before horse power. Well, I always ran out of horsepower first with my 1025r. Then I upgraded to a 3046r cab model and I ran out of horsepower. I now have a 2038r and... I ran out of horsepower. All have had r4 tires and no wheel weights. This was my first chance on the 2038r to see what it would do. I was a bit disappointed as I was hoping to just pull it straight through the ground. I was not taking a full bite either... I had the loader on but no material in the bucket.

IMG 9406 - YouTube

IMG 9405 - YouTube

IMG 9404 - YouTube


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I can see why you would run out of horsepower. You sure were plowing deep. If that is virgin soil, it’s going to be tough to plow the first time. Next year will be easier. By the way, are you sure you ran out of horsepower with the 3046r pulling the single bottom plow? If so, why did you downgrade to a 2038r?

good videos!
 

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I’ve seen a video from Messicks that explains that the farther you push a hydrostatic pedal that essentially the higher gear you are running. So a petal all the way down would be like pulling in 6th gear of your truck. I can spin all 4 tires of my 2025r in dry soil but not if I have the forward petal all the way to the floor. Looks like you have it pinned all the way down. Maybe try to let up about halfway. I’ll bet it has plenty of power to spin the tires.


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What range are you in in those videos - low or high?

Also - when you come upon some resistance are you pushing harder in the go pedal? That’s not how these tractors work - by pushing down on the go pedal you are essentially pushing it into a higher gear.
 

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What range are you in in those videos - low or high?

Also - when you come upon some resistance are you pushing harder in the go pedal? That’s not how these tractors work - by pushing down on the go pedal you are essentially pushing it into a higher gear.
Based on how far the pedal is moving or let’s say not moving, the noise and the speed your going it looks like high.


Op,
Switch it to low and you will run out of traction first. :good2:
 

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I'm with the three previous posters :thumbup1gif:
When you meet some resistance ease off on the go pedal and let the engine catch back up. And just curious, why are you hanging two suitcase weights that high up on the ROPS, if you are looking for weight for pulling, weight down low is the way to go. :thumbup1gif:
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Hey Guys,

I was in low range, full throttle, and the differential lock was on along with 4 wheel drive.

Who cares about virgin ground or that I’m plowing deep. This is just to show that the 2038r will indeed run out of horsepower before traction.

This plow is new to this tractor. I sold the 3046 when I moved to a smaller lot and the cab wouldn’t fit. I sure miss it.

This tractor only has two gears. High and low. Pressing the pedals does not provide any gearing effect whatsoever. If the pedals provided a gearing effect then there would only be high range since you can get the exact same speed with high as you can with low. The only “gearing effect” is perceived solely because it’s easier to pull something at a slower speed than higher speed.


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I'm with the three previous posters :thumbup1gif:
When you meet some resistance ease off on the go pedal and let the engine catch back up. And just curious, why are you hanging two suitcase weights that high up on the ROPS, if you are looking for weight for pulling, weight down low is the way to go. :thumbup1gif:
Because that’s the only place I could find to hang them! I lost stability (although it wasn’t needed) but ground pressure was the same regardless of where they were. I felt that with the loader on that it unloaded the rear a bit so I wanted to put some weight back on the rears.


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I noticed in one of your videos you are riding the brakes, FYI.
 

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I do not doubt what you are saying. In the right conditions, improper application of the attachments a D-9 Cat-Dozer will get stuck in ground engagement.
 

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Hey Guys,

I was in low range, full throttle, and the differential lock was on along with 4 wheel drive.

Who cares about virgin ground or that I’m plowing deep. This is just to show that the 2038r will indeed run out of horsepower before traction.

This plow is new to this tractor. I sold the 3046 when I moved to a smaller lot and the cab wouldn’t fit. I sure miss it.

This tractor only has two gears. High and low. Pressing the pedals does not provide any gearing effect whatsoever. If the pedals provided a gearing effect then there would only be high range since you can get the exact same speed with high as you can with low. The only “gearing effect” is perceived solely because it’s easier to pull something at a slower speed than higher speed.


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Sorry but I totally disagree with this. Pressing the go pedal down causes the wheels to turn faster - ie a higher gear ratio.
 

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Sorry but I totally disagree with this. Pressing the go pedal down causes the wheels to turn faster - ie a higher gear ratio.
Absolutely correct. Hydrostatic is like having an infinite speed transmission. The lowest gear is barely breathing on the pedal, the highest gear is with the pedal mashed to the floor. The range selector just gives the starting point for each pedal range. Just like a gear tractor has a range selector L-M-H and then gear selections 1-2-3-4-5-6. The hydro is the same way. Range L-M-H (or L-H in this case) and then the pedal gives you infinite speeds within each range.
 

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Sorry but I totally disagree with this. Pressing the go pedal down causes the wheels to turn faster - ie a higher gear ratio.
I agree. If you think of a 40 ton bottle jack it only moves about 1/16 each pump where a 3 ton jack may move half an inch each pump. Pushing petal farther opens valve more with the same amount of flow coming from the pump. It will move more with less petal and the same amount of throttle not because of speed but because of higher pressure. Atleast that’s how I understand it.


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What range are you in in those videos - low or high?

Also - when you come upon some resistance are you pushing harder in the go pedal? That’s not how these tractors work - by pushing down on the go pedal you are essentially pushing it into a higher gear.
In that 3rd video as the tractor bogged down the OP appeared to further mash the pedal to the floor. That is like shifting into high gear on a gear drive tractor. Your tractor will transmit maximum power to the wheels with the range selector in LOW and then just barely breathing on the forward pedal.

Not to worry, treating the FWD/REV pedals like the accelerator on a car is a common misconception among hydrostatic tractor owners.
 

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There are a LOT of videos on YouTube which explain how a hydrostatic transmission work. Below is just one example which explains how the swashplate works. The swashplate is what controls the speed and power and it is controlled by the movement of your forward and reverse pedals.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MTeJWE_Ou0g
 

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The hydro is a little hard to understand,, but, it does change the ratio between the engine and the wheels.

In the same manner that you stall that tractor,, I could easily stall a 150 HP farm tractor with that same plow that you are using.
So, adding horsepower will not correct your issue.

Gear ratio is an amazing thing,,,
 

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HP/Traction

Call your JD dealer and tell him you would like to demo one of these for the weekend:

9620R.jpeg
 

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I've always been under the impression that most tractor work (especially ground engaging or pulling) should be done in low range and that high is typically just for traveling around between tasks. Not to say you couldn't mow in high or something, but for plowing I'd definitely be in low. I would think your experience with traction vs. power would be much different in low.

I'm not saying that the weights up on the ROPs is a majorly bad idea, but I'm sure there must be better ways to deal with that??

Rob
 

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Discussion Starter #19
I’m sorry but you all are incorrect with the hydro pedals changing gear ratios. Gear ratios are determined by the ratio of engine rpm to wheel rpm. In a hydro the gearing ratio is that ratio with the pedal fully depressed. A high low hydro is like a geared tractor with only 4th and 8th gear.

For example, a geared tractor in 2nd gear, 2000 rpm will out pull a hydro tractor in low gear, 2000 rpm and the hydro halfway depressed even though they are moving at the same speed and the ratios are the same.


For those who disagree please explain this to me. If a 3046r in C range at 2000 rpm goes 4 miles per hour but can’t even climb a hill even though the pedal is barely depressed (according to y’all that means that it is a lower gear). You take that same tractor at the same rpm, same speed of 4 miles per hour. The only difference is that you put it into low range. You now have to depress the pedal much farther in order to achieve that speed. According to you this means that it shifts into a higher gear. Yet it will go up the hill whilst pulling a plow. Why is this? Why are there different ranges?

That’s because the gearing ratio is determined by the range you’re in and not the swash plate. If the swash plate determined that then the gearing ratio would be the same: rpm of engine versus rpm of wheels. If the swash plate determined that then there would only be a range C.

I think y’all are missing the point of the video. This is only to prove that the 2038r will stall out and not just sit there and spin. Who cares about how far the pedal is depressed. So many people say that a small Tractor such as this will only sit and spin. So many say, “You can’t get the horsepower to the ground.” Well, I just proved that even with r4 tires you can get the power to the ground, you don’t just sit there and spin.

For what’s it worth, when having the pedal only slightly depressed the tractor would just sit there and whine at me. It did not move. It did not spin. No more power was added to the wheels. Fully depressing the pedal diverted all flow through the bypass which obviously isn’t large enough to handle it so the engine bogged down and died.


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Discussion Starter #20
I've always been under the impression that most tractor work (especially ground engaging or pulling) should be done in low range and that high is typically just for traveling around between tasks. Not to say you couldn't mow in high or something, but for plowing I'd definitely be in low. I would think your experience with traction vs. power would be much different in low.

I'm not saying that the weights up on the ROPs is a majorly bad idea, but I'm sure there must be better ways to deal with that??

Rob
The tractor was in low! :)

I had those weights on for the 30 minutes it took to plow that. They are off now and will only go on again next year for this. It literally took all of 30 seconds to pick them up and put them there. It was just a quick way to add some weight.


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