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Discussion Starter #1
My forester advised me that I could have extra work done while the dozer was on site doing the roads and prep work for the log deck.

I'm thinking of having them grade the driveway to create a drainage ditch, and fix a low spot that funnels water over my driveway as it currently sits.

I'm also contemplating having him work on my pistol pit, but that's really a job better suited for a big loader or excavator. I want to dig into an existing slope rather than just pushing up berms.

Since the dozer will be gone when the logging commences, I can't have them clear stumps or anything useful like that.

What would you do if you had use of a dozer at potentially a discounted rate?
 

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My forester advised me that I could have extra work done while the dozer was on site doing the roads and prep work for the log deck.

I'm thinking of having them grade the driveway to create a drainage ditch, and fix a low spot that funnels water over my driveway as it currently sits.

I'm also contemplating having him work on my pistol pit, but that's really a job better suited for a big loader or excavator. I want to dig into an existing slope rather than just pushing up berms.

Since the dozer will be gone when the logging commences, I can't have them clear stumps or anything useful like that.

What would you do if you had use of a dozer at potentially a discounted rate?
me-i'dl fix all the roads u want to have. crown them, etc. then how bout clearing the house, garage lot spots of the stumps, brush, get that all ready so the ground settles good for u. u could then be ready to burn that while maybe snow is on the ground.

are the log trucks gonna use the road u built that u showed us? will it hold up to that kind of use? can u still get that cheap rock type stuff u had hauled before?
maybe after there gone, get more of that hauled in, use the dozer to grade that then better?:dunno:
 

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My forester advised me that I could have extra work done while the dozer was on site doing the roads and prep work for the log deck.

I'm thinking of having them grade the driveway to create a drainage ditch, and fix a low spot that funnels water over my driveway as it currently sits.

I'm also contemplating having him work on my pistol pit, but that's really a job better suited for a big loader or excavator. I want to dig into an existing slope rather than just pushing up berms.

Since the dozer will be gone when the logging commences, I can't have them clear stumps or anything useful like that.

What would you do if you had use of a dozer at potentially a discounted rate?
If you have an X knock her house down.. Just don't fall into the cellar! Okay now to be serious; It sounds like all you can do right now is grade the road as BJ suggested and create drainage ditches. To bad the dozer will be gone after the timber is harvested, it would come in very handy.. I good operator could work your pistol pit without creating berms, No? But don't you want some berms for stray bullets? All our gun clubs around here have berms just for this purpose. Jeff
 

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Discussion Starter #6
I don't know that they'll need to come back for clean up afterwards. The ground is frozen, so they're dozing roads for the semi's and the skidders and such will run on the ground as she lays (which isn't too lumpy aside from the old blow down root mounds and occasional field nugget; aka: boulder :laugh: ).

We're having the tops and any non-rotted debris chipped, so I'll be left with little twiggy stuff that falls off when felling and skidding, and stumps, but that's about it.

As for my pistol pit - it's currently covered in high quality trees. I don't know how kindly the loggers would take to finding an acre dozed up and piled with dirt and root balls attached. :laugh: But since it's also on a slope, the idea is to cut a flat bottom and build a smaller berm so that from outside the excavation it appears to not be much of anything. Just mounding all that fill around the edges would be a problem with the county as I'd need a permit for the earth moving unless I'm specifically using it for my roads.

They're already going to be potentially using my house and shop site for a landing, so that work is covered. I'm not sure if we're going to use it or one of the larger clearings to the South where I'm putting food plots or fruit trees. That's something my forester hasn't addressed since we've switched sides on our access to the heavy capacity roads.

My swamp road, as Jim asked about, would need one of the culverts to be covered in more fill first, but would handle a semi no problem. The issue has always been that the beach road is barely 16' wide and 1.5 miles long of not semi friendly turns and overgrown trees (it needs serious trimming, but the township only seems to care about my 400' of frontage). They won't grant me an overload permit for logging, and specifically said as much when allowing my swamp crossing to be built.

The access through the neighbor's property is specifically to address the 7T axle weight limit on the beach road. By going out the other side of the block, we come out on a 10T county road which has direct access to a highway. The beach road comes out on another 7T road with over 4 miles of distance to cover to reach a 10T road. The beach road is in poor repair as it is, so they'd never let me use it for over-weight traffic unless it was a one-time deal (and that's iffy too).
 

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I don't know that they'll need to come back for clean up afterwards. The ground is frozen, so they're dozing roads for the semi's and the skidders and such will run on the ground as she lays (which isn't too lumpy aside from the old blow down root mounds and occasional field nugget; aka: boulder :laugh: ).

We're having the tops and any non-rotted debris chipped, so I'll be left with little twiggy stuff that falls off when felling and skidding, and stumps, but that's about it.

As for my pistol pit - it's currently covered in high quality trees. I don't know how kindly the loggers would take to finding an acre dozed up and piled with dirt and root balls attached. :laugh: But since it's also on a slope, the idea is to cut a flat bottom and build a smaller berm so that from outside the excavation it appears to not be much of anything. Just mounding all that fill around the edges would be a problem with the county as I'd need a permit for the earth moving unless I'm specifically using it for my roads.

They're already going to be potentially using my house and shop site for a landing, so that work is covered. I'm not sure if we're going to use it or one of the larger clearings to the South where I'm putting food plots or fruit trees. That's something my forester hasn't addressed since we've switched sides on our access to the heavy capacity roads.

My swamp road, as Jim asked about, would need one of the culverts to be covered in more fill first, but would handle a semi no problem. The issue has always been that the beach road is barely 16' wide and 1.5 miles long of not semi friendly turns and overgrown trees (it needs serious trimming, but the township only seems to care about my 400' of frontage). They won't grant me an overload permit for logging, and specifically said as much when allowing my swamp crossing to be built.

The access through the neighbor's property is specifically to address the 7T axle weight limit on the beach road. By going out the other side of the block, we come out on a 10T county road which has direct access to a highway. The beach road comes out on another 7T road with over 4 miles of distance to cover to reach a 10T road. The beach road is in poor repair as it is, so they'd never let me use it for over-weight traffic unless it was a one-time deal (and that's iffy too).
I have only one word..... Crud! Nothing I can add to help you feel better at all... But;;; Instead of logging what about fuel such as wood pellets? You're not logging right? chip it up right at the site for the first part of production in the line, If they even do this?... Semantics, or the over weight issue? Then cut the load weights down??? Maybe.
Have a nice Christmas. JT
 

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Sounds like you need to take the dozer to your county reg's.

A permit to move your own dirt.....
 

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Discussion Starter #9
I have only one word..... Crud! Nothing I can add to help you feel better at all... But;;; Instead of logging what about fuel such as wood pellets? You're not logging right? chip it up right at the site for the first part of production in the line, If they even do this?... Semantics, or the over weight issue? Then cut the load weights down??? Maybe.
Have a nice Christmas. JT
We're going out through the neighbor's place. The road "I've been building" is my driveway which goes to the beach road. If you cut the load weights down, you lose the profitability to the sale and no logger will touch it. We're talking about hundreds of truck trips over 2 weeks. Man-hours and fuel to haul to the mills are fixed costs per load. You'd never cut your volume hauled to double those costs and stay in business.


As for the county earth moving regs: I agree completely! It's a load of $%^+!
 

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Roads first

I would tend to go overboard on the road drainage, crowns, waterbars etc. As you know a good dozer operator with a 6 way blade can do some really fine work as well as moving big stuff.

Usually the dozer will hang around to clear the log deck area. If so, you can get any extra work in that area done easily so if you want a larger flat deck area, go for it. If they stayed around very long, I would go for a fire line/woods road around the property. I'm probably going to rent a dozer just to push 1/2 mile or so of fire break through pretty light brush but I need to get down to mineral earth.

Treefarmer
 

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Discussion Starter #11
I need to find my pic of the logging and change how the access fits in so you guys can see what we're doing. I've been somewhat holding out for Al to send me his revised one with the GPS lines laid out from his work, but he hasn't sent it yet.

The areas that need to be flat are already pretty flat on my land. I've planned my changes around the topography rather than changing what the earth has already given me to work with. Cutting the ditches was something I'd expected to have to do once all was done, but I'll be in a good spot to have them do it for me so that's what I'll do.
 

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What would you do if you had use of a dozer at potentially a discounted rate?
Remove 10 acres of red cedars from the property and install a 5' culvert to allow me (and the JD) to cross our creek. The sad reality is that I will likely pay full price for this work later this year. I don't begrudge paying folks for work done, but I am new enough to these neck of the woods that I don't know the ends and outs of the local barter network.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Remove 10 acres of red cedars from the property and install a 5' culvert to allow me (and the JD) to cross our creek. The sad reality is that I will likely pay full price for this work later this year. I don't begrudge paying folks for work done, but I am new enough to these neck of the woods that I don't know the ends and outs of the local barter network.
Rent one! I can't think of a more fun way to spend some vacation days than in an air conditioned cab doing earth moving. :yahoo:
 

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Forget the pistol pit . MaKE SURE they are not going to leave you a mud road and trash , slash everywhere ! These guys do not make money on restoration . Get a time frame for decent weather and follow that . Make sure that wood chuck understands what you want , also the loggers . Seen too many horror stories on this subject !
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Forget the pistol pit . MaKE SURE they are not going to leave you a mud road and trash , slash everywhere ! These guys do not make money on restoration . Get a time frame for decent weather and follow that . Make sure that wood chuck understands what you want , also the loggers . Seen too many horror stories on this subject !
The outfit doing the cutting is a local business, not a fly-by-azz "logger" who's trying to keep the bank from repoing all their stuff.

My forester retired from 36 years with the DNR doing state and commercial land jobs. Now he's on his own because he loves being in the woods and only works for private small land owners (farmers, country folk, hunters) and his main thing is habitat creation and stand preservation. He's equally disgusted with what the crew did to my West neighbor's place a few years ago as I am - they never asked if I wanted any work done and in time I've learned not having them cut on my property was the best thing that could've happened! I've seen this crew's work, and I've seen my forester's work from the beginning to end on a buddy's property (same outfit logged it as is doing mine) - I'm not getting absolute top dollar for my timber, but my land will not be molested and raped either.

Their videos don't work on their website for me, but do open when clicking the alternate links on the page.

Fletcher Logging

My neighbor got high graded in the worst way. They left so much crap it'd take years to clean up. My forester won't let that happen and doesn't deal with outfits that leave a mess or do any damage.
 

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Rent one! I can't think of a more fun way to spend some vacation days than in an air conditioned cab doing earth moving. :yahoo:
That is an option, for sure. However, I have found that professional operators can accomplish in hours what might take me days. Back in 1979 I operated a CAT D7 for a month while on "Christmas Break." I got the job on the canal project based on my experience as a Diesel Mechanic student, which required a first semester Heavy equipment operations course. I enjoyed the job, which lasted just over one month, but learned that some tasks are best left to the experts.
 

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