1) Am I going to have trouble finding attachments for a 318 or 445? Not if you are patient and willing to drive to get what you want
How about service? Probably cost more for dealer service (if they’ll do it) than what you’d want to spend on a 30 year old garden tractor

2) Am I getting myself into more maintenance than I want as a firstime owner? Probably yes, unless your a hobbyist or enthusiast. Things are worn out, seals leak, wiring corrodes, etc.
Even with one in good condition? 1000 hours or less seem reasonable? Probably yes. Parts also wear out with age. Plastic becomes brittle, gaskets leak, grease dries out

3) Other than creature comforts, what might I be missing out on that's actually useful? I was excited to see that the 445 is 4whell steer. Front end loader, three point hitch, 540 rear PTO. Available on some of the old GTs as options but not common.
*This is comparing a SCUT to the older GTs.
Are you looking at X500/700 machines new or like a 1025?

 

If your not going to do your own maintenance and repairs it will get expensive to own the older tractors.

They are fully capable though, and can save a DIY person significantly over newer.

If you share a little more about your needs and wants we can give better information about the differences in models that would matter to you.

 

My newest tractor is an X300. We have a bunch of older, much older ones, the oldest is a 1969 140H3. I like the simplicity of the old ones. There hasn't been anything I haven't been able to get for any of them, be it parts or attachments. There's a list in my sig below.

 

I cut for four hours a week during the VA grass season with a 1988 John Deere 430. It does require maintenance but no more than any other 1300 hour machine. If you are willing to do or learn to do the maintenance and repairs the older machines aren’t that bad to keep up. If you are going to have a dealer work on it you may as well buy new because you’ll probably spend the same amount over time.


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For a first-time tractor buyer I would absolutely recommend a newer machine like an X Series. The old machines are great and less complex, but they DO require more care, replacing old parts that deteriorate with age, and hunting for parts that may no longer be in production. The newer stuff is much more "turn-key", better ergonomics, and you're not going to be tearing it apart to replace old points, cracked fuel lines, bad PTO coils, leaking seals, and any badly done repairs done by a previous unqualified owner.
This is what Id recommend to any friend looking for a first garden tractor.

 

I ran a 430 for about 10 years, doing 4 hours or so per cut.
In late spring/early summer it was less than 7 days between cuts.
Later had an opportunity to add a well priced 455. They were traded on a 740, which was later sold when we moved. 6 years later we moved again and have returned to GT world. This time snow clearing was added to the job list, so the AWD x738 acquired.

Point of all this is that once you go to a foot controlled hydrostat, you won't want to go back to a hand controlled one. Especially if the job has some back-up / go-ahead turns to trim about trees/bushes/gardens/whatevers.

The RIO thing on the newer ones can be annoying at first, but I found it quickly became second nature to use the hand that used to do the motion control duties to run the lever to keep deck engaged when backing up with the 740. We don't have kids around running it anymore, but I'm so used to running the lever that I haven't done any of the common overrides on the current machine..

 

The newer machines are more efficient at mowing, but they lack the heavy duty feel of the old ones, which had a lot less plastic. The older machines are heavier, more durable, have more metal, and a lot of parts are still available. The implements and attachments for the older machines would have to be purchased from other owners, salvage yards, and if lucky you might find an implement or attachment used at a dealer. You can order an implement or attachment for a new machine from your dealer, but more than likely not for an older machine.

 

It depends on what you want to do with it but a old one is fine but not something you want to use every day go on Craigslist or market place and you can find anything you want for it and parts can generally be ordered

 

Personally, I would only recommend older machines if you are willing to dive in and do all your own wrenching. Kind of like buying an old classic car to work on. Sure, you can drive it to work when it's running, but you still need to get to your job when it's laid up in the the garage.

 

Get a new one for your wife to use if she is so inclined and get the more rugged built to last old one for you to have some thing to play with, works for me.

 

My wife used all my vintage garden tractors when we had a larger property, and still comments that she misses using them to this day. The herd included 318s, two 322s and two all wheel steer units (a 2004 X495 diesel and a much smaller 2007 X304...) plus some other odds and ends like a 317. Mowing with the foot ground speed controls of the later tractors is much preferred over the earlier GTs like the 318 and 322. Power steering on any of these is a big advantage, and as noted the later tractors have the RIO nuisances. All machines take regular maintenance, so be prepared to do that and to understand that any deferred maintenance that predates your purchase will be something you need to accommodate during your watch. Diesels are more robust engines, but cooling is still an important maintenance item, both the radiators and the air vents.

All wheel steer is a neat feature for mowing and other jobs where lots of maneuvering around obstacles is required, and it will reduce the need to back up somewhat when mowing around hardscapes. BUT -- the AWS machines do kick out the rear a bit in the opposite direction of a tight turn and this can be an issue when removing snow at a curb or wall... Also, the AWS machines are not recommended for FEL use.

Chuck

 

If you think you might want a fel I whould say just get a 1023e with the 60d

 

I would personally stay with older due to a bad expirience we had with a newer Lawn tractor.(2006 Gx 345 They are supposed to be a decent tractor) i enjoy using the 316 318 322 330 332 420 and 430 how ever the 425 445 and 455 have a better deck design and will cut much nicer! Hope it helps!

 

Thanks for all he quick and helpful replies! Gives me the sense that the dealer isn't up selling me. Several folks mentioned being prepared to put significant time into maintenance and repairs with the older machines. I like tinkering, but I don't know a lot about engines, and I want to be able to spend my nights and weekends on the landscaping work.

As for the options I'm looking at, I'm targeting x500 series and used x700 at the right price. Mostly for the stronger transmission. Also looking at the high end of Cub Cadet and Husqvarna garden tractors to be honest (don't shoot!). CC uses the K66 and has a steal drive shaft.

We have 1.5 acres, half wooded with a 20 ft drop that mostly happens mid yard over 10 yards or so. So some pretty steep inclines in parts. We're planning to do most of our own landscaping including flower and vegetable beds, rock/brick laying for a patio digging out a water feature, etc. There's still a lot of brush and brick to clear, and lots of leaves of course. And we're planning to do all the upkeep, too, of course. So I need a workhorse. Was originally thinking about the 1025r or Kubota Bx subs, but that's probably more than I need on the regular, and can rent for jobs as needed.

Thanks again!

 

Don't forget to also look at the earlier diesel X495 model like I had (or its gas engine siblings like the x485...) which were roughly equivalent to the later X700 series machines. My 2004 X495 was a very robust machine that I would still have if I still had acreage.

Chuck

 

I can attest to the older tractor and doing maintenance, my 430 is 30 years old! My point being buy new, maintain, understand, don’t misuse, buy for the long haul and it will payoff!
when I bought my 430 it was expensive and some people thought I was crazy, still have it!

 

I should also add, the truck in the back ground, has 344’xxx miles on it, bought it new, my banker was pissed at me when bought it, said it was the most expensive vehicle Ford made at the time, guess what, my banker, no longer works at the bank, his wife got caught embezzling from the business she worked at as an accountant and he was basicly shamed out the door! If you take care of equipment it will take care of you! JMO!
I’m considering a new 1025R but haven’t been able to convince myself to spend the money and sell something that works as good as a my 430, we’ll see!

 

Hi folks! First-time poster and first-time tractor buyer. I know I need a garden tractor (not a lawn tractor, and am on the boarder between that and a sun). For the sake of argument, let's assume I make my wife happy and stick with a garden tractor

I've seen people say that their 318s, 445s, etc. are still running strong and it sounds like they have performance of the current x500 series without all the new tech. I was recently asking a dealer about a used one they had, and she said I should be careful because parts and attachments are hard to come by. I'm sure she's right in that I can't just go to the dealer and buy them, but these were so popular I'm guessing there are a lot of old or aftermarket attachments out there. If she's just trying o help me out, great! I'm always expecting dealers to be up-selling.

So what do you think? Obviously I'm not asking if I should buy one. That's personal and case-specific.

1) Am I going to have trouble finding attachments for a 318 or 445? How about service?

2) Am I getting myself into more maintenance than I want as a firstime owner? Even with one in good condition? 1000 hours or less seem reasonable?

3) Other than creature comforts, what might I be missing out on that's actually useful? I was excited to see that the 445 is 4whell steer.

Thanks!

If you decide to buy something made prior to 1992 then you get hand held controls, attachments that are not as easy to attach/detach (for example if you get an FEL it won't be a quick detach and neither will the bucket, they are bolt on), generally a little more maintenance. You can source the majority of your parts on Ebay as used parts. You can still get consumables from the dealer. I was able to get mower belts, points, condenser, filters, tune up stuff for my 400 when I had it.

If you get some thing made from 1992 on they are fairly maintenance free other than normal maintenance unless they have been abused/non-maintained. The bonus is most of the attachments are easier to hook up, ergonomics are better, foot controls, easier access to parts from the dealer. The 4x5 series of garden tractors are great to start out on and have become reasonably priced for used machines. Don't be afraid of high hours if the machine looks like it was taken care of.

When it comes to garden tractors, I have never bought a new JD but have had several used machines. I have never regretted any purchase of a used machine. I will say be prepared to do some work on a pre-1992 machine since most of them are over 30 years old and quite few approaching the 40 year mark.

 

One of the older GT's would be great to have as a secondary machine, but unless you've found a fully restored one, and have the service manual for it and the mechanical ability to work on it, I wouldn't depend on one as an "only" tractor. As they get older, they tend to get more temperamental. Finding the best attachments (like a 3-point hitch, rear PTO or front loader being the main ones) can be a treasure hunt. Those who have them for their older machines are usually unwilling to part with them, and they aren't being made any more. If all you want is a mower, not as much an issue, most will have a deck, but be sure to look it over well, those get a ton of use.

I've had an '84 model 318 for about 5 years; it was partially restored (new paint and ring job on the engine), and it is great to use when I need to mow a little and have the mower off my bigger tractor, but I wouldn't want it as my only machine. It uses a bit of oil, (needs valve guides), and the hand control has never been a favorite. Foot control is more intuitive and convenient.

Don't know what kind of budget you have, but I'd look for a well cared for X7 of some sort from the 2006-2012 era, you can still get the major accessories and they will do anything you want, and will likely be more reliable in the long run. I had a X748 for 11 years and it is the perfect machine for mowing and moderate gardening.