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Corndog Hater
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A wise forum member advised me to seek out the advice of the other wise members here in regards to modifying my pole barn. The backstory is this barn was built in 1991 to house livestock, it had 6 stalls. The first thing I did was remove the stalls in 2006 when we bought the place. It has served us ok as a catch all and place to keep the equipment under cover. However, the poles are often/always in the way, among other things. I have been patching and replacing shingles on the roof for the last 5 years or so as the roof is original to 1991. We would like to get our camper under cover in the winter and for any extended period when we might not use it. In order to do that, mods must be made. We contemplated a new building. We got an estimate for a 28' x 48' building with 16' ceiling height. It included (2) 12' x 14' overhead doors and a man door. It would be metal sided and roofed, with no floor included in the price. Also, the Amish that gave me the estimate would dismantle the existing barn and resell the "distressed" board and no money would change hands. The estimate was $25,000. I have asked around and that seems high, as I also thought. So, we decided to try to work with what we have. The original main part of the barn measures 30' x 30'. It is built with 4" x 6" poles, 10' on center. The previous owner then added on a 10' "shed" onto the side. The shallow pitch of the roof has been a thorn in my side since day one. Unfortunately the original 30' x 30' in not big enough to house our 36.5' long camper (hitch to bumper and including the spare tire). I have had one of the civil engineers from work come out and look at the barn. He thinks what we are proposing is fine. I am including original pics and then the same pics mocked up to show our proposed mods. I'm looking for any additional thoughts or ideas, as there is more than one way to skin a cat. Thanks!
 

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Corndog Hater
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Discussion Starter #2
Here are the mocked up pics...................Oh, and excuse the mess!!!!
 

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Premium Member
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:munch:

I'm just guessing; but cutting out the loft's floor joists may cause problems with load transfer to the ground, especially during the winter when you get heavy snows. The joists and floor add lateral stability too.

If your civil engineer buddy does structural work too; this should be an easy set of calculations for him to do. Otherwise I'll bet he knows a structural engineer willing to verify what you have in mind will work.

Just don't use corndog sticks as structural members. :laugh:
 

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CP- i hope u find money in ur budget for a concrete floor-cause we all know how its gonna end for ya--the money will never show its ugly head of being available later--please do it now-5 yrs from now u can thank me then-ok:munch:
 

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Bonehead Club Lackey
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Hope you have someone that knows what he's doing. You're changing the whole structure of the barn and the way it's held together.
 

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Corndog Hater
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Discussion Starter #7
Thanks for the comments folks. This project or the way I have it proposed, is not carved in stone yet. Mrs. CP and I are cheap skates, so we'll see. I went back and looked at my pics, and it doesn't show that the hay loft floor is independent of the structure. The weight of the roof is transferred to the poles, not the hay loft floor joists. My engineer friend pointed that out. He also said to add as much horizontal bracing as we could up on the roof supports and the walls between the poles. Keep the comments and thoughts coming.
 

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My .02 here, why don't you keep the "shed" area, just close it off from the rest of the barn? Maybe increase the pitch? I just would have trouble stomaching REMOVING covered storage. I'd keep it just for odds and ends, rakes, small yard cart, small stuff...

As the others have said, you are changing the entire structure of the barn...

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Corndog Hater
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Discussion Starter #9
My .02 here, why don't you keep the "shed" area, just close it off from the rest of the barn? Maybe increase the pitch? I just would have trouble stomaching REMOVING covered storage. I'd keep it just for odds and ends, rakes, small yard cart, small stuff...

As the others have said, you are changing the entire structure of the barn...

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If I was to keep it, the roof pitch would surely change. The engineer I had out recommended removing it to eliminate any "pull" that snow accumulating on that shallow pitched roof might levy on the rest of the barn. I know a guy who I think knows a structural guy, I'm going to get in touch with him.
 

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Like the others, I question the integrity when you remove all those joists and rafters. The floor joists for second level appear to handle the lateral load of the gambrel roof. Keeps it from wanting to squat down and out. Not saying something can’t be designed to stop it. Just gonna be some work involved.
Ever think about just coming out of front with another section of building attached to store the RV?
As far as the flat shed roof...Looks like you are due for new roof anyway. I would just build false work of rafters and mid supports angled down. Throw some purlins across rafters every two feet down and put a metal roof on it. Personally I would hate to lose storage space but I understand concerns of snow on the flatish roof exsisting now. Especially in NY.

E6695E8B-ADC3-4C39-91E9-84B1195113A1.jpeg
 

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Senior GTT Super Slacker
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Way too much work CP and it will probably never be to your liking.
I would think one of these would do you just fine if you have the real-estate...


With the left over money you could buy yourself a couple of nice SxS's
 

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Corndog Hater
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Discussion Starter #12
Way too much work CP and it will probably never be to your liking.
I would think one of these would do you just fine if you have the real-estate...
With the left over money you could buy yourself a couple of nice SxS's

Have you been talking to my wife? This is what she wants. Unfortunately, our lot isn't too wide in the vicinity of the house, barn and garage. I'd also still be concerned about snow load on one of those carports. And that is why I want the camper inside, so I don't have to clean snow off of anything. Mrs. CP has told me to forget the whole thing and just re roof the barn and add some overhead doors. She insists that the camper is made to be outside. Is it? If it is, then why does every manufacturer and dealer remind you to be sure to take care of the roof? Clean it and check the seams at least twice a year is what is recommended.
 

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Corndog Hater
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Discussion Starter #13
Like the others, I question the integrity when you remove all those joists and rafters. The floor joists for second level appear to handle the lateral load of the gambrel roof. Keeps it from wanting to squat down and out. Not saying something can’t be designed to stop it. Just gonna be some work involved.
Ever think about just coming out of front with another section of building attached to store the RV?
As far as the flat shed roof...Looks like you are due for new roof anyway. I would just build false work of rafters and mid supports angled down. Throw some purlins across rafters every two feet down and put a metal roof on it. Personally I would hate to lose storage space but I understand concerns of snow on the flatish roof exsisting now. Especially in NY.
I need to get up in there and take another look. My engineer friend and another friend who is very knowledgable about building both said the barn was built with the hay loft floor bearing no weight. The poles in the middle only hold the floor up, so they can be removed along with the floor. A structural expert's opinion is the only way I'd do anything with peace of mind. As for that shed, at a minimum, it needs a better roof design, and a door at the other end. Truthfully, 90% of what is in that shed, and the hay loft, could go in a dumpster. And yes, the barn needing a new roof is why I'm looking to do something now. Thanks!:good2:
 

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Truthfully, 90% of what is in that shed, and the hay loft, could go in a dumpster.
That's probably true for most of our barns/garages/sheds! :laugh: I know it is for mine! (Not to mention the stupid storage unit I rented "for just a couple of months" when I sold another piece of property two years ago. :banghead:)


Cool barn, by the way!! :good2:
 

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Bonehead Club Lackey
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Have you been talking to my wife? This is what she wants. Unfortunately, our lot isn't too wide in the vicinity of the house, barn and garage. I'd also still be concerned about snow load on one of those carports. And that is why I want the camper inside, so I don't have to clean snow off of anything. Mrs. CP has told me to forget the whole thing and just re roof the barn and add some overhead doors. She insists that the camper is made to be outside. Is it? If it is, then why does every manufacturer and dealer remind you to be sure to take care of the roof? Clean it and check the seams at least twice a year is what is recommended.
Wouldn't an enclosed trailer for storage and a couple of tents do the same thing after you sell the camper? :munch:


BTW, the plastic vents and the putty used to seal the seams of the metal is what you need to keep an eye on. If you have pull outs then the rubber needs to be looked at once in a while.
 

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Corndog Hater
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Discussion Starter #16
Wouldn't an enclosed trailer for storage and a couple of tents do the same thing after you sell the camper? :munch:


BTW, the plastic vents and the putty used to seal the seams of the metal is what you need to keep an eye on. If you have pull outs then the rubber needs to be looked at once in a while.

Tent camping?:dunno: Surely you jest!:laugh: We are glampers through and through!:good2:

I forgot you used to build them. Yes, the putty around the seams we check frequently. We added slide toppers for the slides to protect them. I have thought about buying a cover for the whole thing, but I've heard so many pros and cons to that. The biggest con seems to be that the cover prevents air circulation and promotes mold growth on the roof.:dunno:
 

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Don't know much about barn construction, but learning, usually the hard way. Have you considered removing the sideshed with the problem roof and replacing it with something high enough for rec vehicle and tie into main barn roof. Could that give you acceptable roof pitch? I have same concerns about snow here in new hampshire and am considering a 12 - 12 pitch on shed I'm building.
 

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Corndog Hater
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Discussion Starter #18
Don't know much about barn construction, but learning, usually the hard way. Have you considered removing the sideshed with the problem roof and replacing it with something high enough for rec vehicle and tie into main barn roof. Could that give you acceptable roof pitch? I have same concerns about snow here in new hampshire and am considering a 12 - 12 pitch on shed I'm building.
Actually the Amish guy gave us 2 estimates. One was for a new barn, the other was to modify the existing barn in much the way you describe. Only the "lean to" for the RV would be on the side of the barn opposite the shed. We would remove the section of barn just left of the front sliding door. That came back at $16,000. I would also have to build a portion of driveway to get the camper down into the lean to. Ultimately we decided that the whole structure would look cobbled together and not what we wanted. Unfortunately, where the shed is, I'm not able to get the camper over there as the pool and deck are in the way.:banghead:
 
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