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Well got another toy. I had been looking at the Hobart Holder 140 welders. Well I went to the store as they had a sale going. I ended up getting a Holder 190 for a little more than what the 140 would have cost. The 190 can do 5/16. I probably won't do anything more than 1/4 but that would be pushing the 140 to the limit where with the 190 it will go better.

I will start with the flux core but being I am a homebrewer I have a 10# and 20# tanks of CO2 for my keg systems. I need to get the adapter though so I can connect it to the regulator.
 

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What type of wire are you using?
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Yeah Handler 190. Not Holder
 

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Well got another toy. I had been looking at the Hobart Holder 140 welders. Well I went to the store as they had a sale going. I ended up getting a Holder 190 for a little more than what the 140 would have cost. The 190 can do 5/16. I probably won't do anything more than 1/4 but that would be pushing the 140 to the limit where with the 190 it will go better.

I will start with the flux core but being I am a homebrewer I have a 10# and 20# tanks of CO2 for my keg systems. I need to get the adapter though so I can connect it to the regulator.
Yeah ok. :lol:
 

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What type of wire are you using?
It came with .030 Flux Core but when I have my first project I will likely get solid core. I am waiting to get any for now until I have that project lined up and figure out how thick the material is going to be.
 

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The reason I was asking about the wire being used drives the type of shielding gas to use. On Flux core wire the letter at the end of the wire designation can determine if C (Co2) or M (Mix). The in-correct gas can have a negative effect on the welding results. Just saying
 

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The reason I was asking about the wire being used drives the type of shielding gas to use. On Flux core wire the letter at the end of the wire designation can determine if C (Co2) or M (Mix). The in-correct gas can have a negative effect on the welding results. Just saying
Yeah, the Flux Core that comes with it is designed to use with no gas. Since they know you don't get a tank with the welder and they are providing everything to get going other than safety equipment. They provided a wire that you don't need gas with.

One question I have is that I read in the manual that they have a different regulator for use with CO2. That said I have read of people just using adapters. So is there a difference with the regulators other than threads? I am familiar with regulators for the beer side of the house and I have several. Any reason I couldn't use one of them if there is a difference? The beer regulators have a high pressure gauge and a low pressure gauge. The high pressure is there to give you an idea of how much gas is left in the tank or more importantly when the HP gauge starts dropping that means you are out of liquid in the tank and it is going to be empty soon. Then the low pressure gauge shows what the regulator is letting out. With beer that LP side is normally set to 10-15psi depending on the temp of the beer and style you are going for. I didn't look at the regulator that came with the welder but it is a dual gauge setup very similar to what we use on the beer side. At least at a glance they are nearly the same but that doesn't mean much.
 

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I also have been thinking my first project should be a cart. I didn't buy one and I have read how many are flimsy. So a perfect excuse to try and find some plans for what I would like to build. I am thinking about something that will have some drawers so I can keep tips and other supplies all together.
 

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The reason I was asking about the wire being used drives the type of shielding gas to use. On Flux core wire the letter at the end of the wire designation can determine if C (Co2) or M (Mix). The in-correct gas can have a negative effect on the welding results. Just saying
Eugene, please help me understand this, generally with "flux core" wire no shielding gas is used, unless there is some special process that I'm unfamiliar with-but for the backyard hobby welder that is the advantage of using flux core wire.
 

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Eugene, please help me understand this, generally with "flux core" wire no shielding gas is used, unless there is some special process that I'm unfamiliar with-but for the backyard hobby welder that is the advantage of using flux core wire.
This is my understanding as well. It lets you get started without as much upfront cost for the tank. Then you can move up to it later. The Flux core is like stick welding in a way where you have the slag that needs to get cleaned up where with MIG the weld will be cleaner and you can go right over it. Flux is better also at times for instance if welding outdoors where wind may blow the shielding gas away on you. Also it works a little better if your materials are not fully clean.

The other reason I went with the 190 is that it is compatible with the spool gun so I have the opportunity to do aluminum at some point if I had the need. I will need 100% argon for that though.
 

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I have some wire called dual-shield. It's 90,000psi and lays down a bead that looks like black glass. It loves the heat and prefers only flat or horizontal welds. It's unforgiving in other positions. Without shielding gas, it'll work and weld semi-decent, but you get zero penetration.

It's fairly rare stuff and not needed for most projects.
 

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Frustrated Flux

This is my understanding as well. It lets you get started without as much upfront cost for the tank. Then you can move up to it later. The Flux core is like stick welding in a way where you have the slag that needs to get cleaned up where with MIG the weld will be cleaner and you can go right over it. Flux is better also at times for instance if welding outdoors where wind may blow the shielding gas away on you. Also it works a little better if your materials are not fully clean.

The other reason I went with the 190 is that it is compatible with the spool gun so I have the opportunity to do aluminum at some point if I had the need. I will need 100% argon for that though.
I bought the Hobart 210 and like you thought I would build the cart with the flux core wire it came with. The wire kept having problems feeding through the tip even replaced the tip with new ones. Also the weld was inconsistent. I became so frustrated I got a tank and bolted it to my wall with straps to finish the cart. Night and day difference. I hope you have better luck trying the flux core.
 

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Sinnister and KennyD,,,


To answer a few questions … Typically Flux Core welding has 2 categories, Self-Shielded and Gas Shield (Dual Shield). Both have Flux on the inside and one requires an additional gas to help the welding process (deeper pen, spatter reduction, less slag on weld, etc). Plus the DS is more user friendly!

One typically is given a spool of wire that requires no bottle for shielding gas. This allows the system to look cheaper when making the original purchase. I suggest to use a Dual shield wire that needs an additional shielding gas. My preference when using FC is to use a Ar/Co2 mix. I like the cleaner look of the welding and I already have that gas in my shop. 75/25 is my go to gas for solid wire as well. You can use the 100% Co2 route but you will see more spatter.

To answer the question if one can use the regulator from the beer fridge :bigbeer:eg so I can not answer that. I do recommend a regulator with a flow meter. This way you can see if you’re having the proper flow rate when welding, so you’re not wasting gas and causing welding related problems with too much gas flow.

Sinnister, not trying to rain on your parade just trying to keep you from getting frustrated with your new toy! Hope this helps if you have any special questions send me a PM and I am always willing to pass on what knowledge I have. you may want to give it some thought since you want to weld Al someday, go ahead and get the regulator because you will need that and take that spool of wire back and exchange it for a solid wire off the get go. Plus pick up a tank of 75/25... just a thought

Been in the welding field for over 32 years. From a production welder, Tool and Die welder, Weld Technician, Welding Instructor and on to my final path as a Welding Engineer. So I have been fortunate enough to have both the practical and book knowledge.

Man are my fingers tired , time for a beer
 

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Discussion Starter #15
I bought the Hobart 210 and like you thought I would build the cart with the flux core wire it came with. The wire kept having problems feeding through the tip even replaced the tip with new ones. Also the weld was inconsistent. I became so frustrated I got a tank and bolted it to my wall with straps to finish the cart. Night and day difference. I hope you have better luck trying the flux core.
By chance did you check your polarity? I have read of a lot of people getting a new welder and assuming this is set right and having welding issues. Of course this doesn't explain the feed issue but might explain the inconsistent weld issue.
 

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Eugene, I may hit you up for that. I also have a motorcycle/home brewing buddy that is a shop teacher at one of the local high schools so I was going to hit him up on this.

I have seen the flow meters so I know what you are talking about. They all have the argon coupler from what I have seen. I have read that there will be a cleaner weld with argon mix and less spatter. The roll of flux core (no gas needed) is just a starter spool that came with the welder. The only additional things I bought were some gloves and tip gel. I already have an auto darkening helmet. I was planning on holding off with getting the solid wire until I was ready for a project like I mentioned and try out the system on CO2. As I mentioned I expect more spatter but my welds are going to be ugly at this point so get some scrap plate and start running beads. Before I do that I need to wire up a 30A circuit.

Thanks for the info so far. It helps.
 

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Tried everything

By chance did you check your polarity? I have read of a lot of people getting a new welder and assuming this is set right and having welding issues. Of course this doesn't explain the feed issue but might explain the inconsistent weld issue.
I even had my best friend who has been welding for over 25 yrs look at the whole thing. he couldn't even get it to feed or weld properly. I put the solid wire and tank on and everything has been working beautifully since. not sure why unless it was a defective roll of flux core wire.
 

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I even had my best friend who has been welding for over 25 yrs look at the whole thing. he couldn't even get it to feed or weld properly. I put the solid wire and tank on and everything has been working beautifully since. not sure why unless it was a defective roll of flux core wire.
That could be. If you don't get a good feed I don't think you could have a good consistent weld. Just thought I would mention the polarity because it has to switch when you go from flux core to solid gas shield welding. It is one of those things I see pop up quite a bit on the new welder posts.
 

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I even had my best friend who has been welding for over 25 yrs look at the whole thing. he couldn't even get it to feed or weld properly. I put the solid wire and tank on and everything has been working beautifully since. not sure why unless it was a defective roll of flux core wire.
Keep in mind when they make that wire, it starts out as a flat plate, flux added and rolled into a tubular shape... sometimes it just isn't there, in my opinion. The smaller the wire the harder it is to manufacture.

To be honest, its hard to trouble shoot something over the net like welding... At least one thing is for sure solid wire gives the least amount of issues when it comes to possible welding problems related to wire type's.

Also keep in mind, a good looking weld doesn't necessarily mean it will hold, I would rather have an ugly weld that holds than a beautiful weld that will fail!! :nunu: depending on what your making someone could get hurt ,,, that's what grinders and paint is for :thumbup1gif: !!!!
 

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CO2 is corrosive and also has a tendency to freeze up Argon based regulators/meters. So you want a flow meter (vs a pressure regulator), and you want it to be designed to be used with straight CO2 for best longevity/results.

190A is a good amount of power for the weekend warrior. I highly suggest at least a 225A MIG for more serious fabrication, with 250A being the sweet spot of filling most tasks (a good SMAW welder can then fill out the heaviest gauges from there if need be). But, for anything 1/4" or less, 190A will get you there with a nice hot arc. Using CO2 will actually get you a little more heat than the chart is tailored to since it's technically a (re)active gas rather than inert. You did good!
 
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