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I have a cottage which is located in the woods about 3/4 of a mile from the township road. Every day I do three return trips. There are many deer here in the winter which attract coyotes. My neighbour (who gets up much earlier than I) has seen fishers in the early hours also. I had bear tracks at my place about 7 years ago to boot.
I take my 27 pound corgi with me on a leash. How can I protect us from an attack? I'd love to be able to have a handgun but carrying one here isn't allowed. Suggestions?
 

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The cans of bear pepper spray that they market to hikers is probably all you'd need. Since a handgun is out, you'd probably have to go to a shotgun if you wanted that level of... deterrent.
 

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The coyotes won't bother you. They won't bother your dog either, if on leash with you. If you allow your dog to roam free, then it can become coyote food. Not an issue for a larger dog, but could be for a Corgi, with coyotes being a pack.

Put your mind at ease. I have 4 different packs of coyotes near me, and can tell each pack by the noises they make when out hunting. My dogs remain in a securely fenced yard around the house, unless they are next to me or indoors, but my largest one now is 22 pounds.

Smaller dogs are likely to become prey for owls, hawks and falcons, even in the yard, so I never let smaller dogs out alone during the times of peak hunting of birds of prey.

Welcome to the country!! You will soon learn to enjoy the lifestyle, and know what is safe, and what requires worry.

Bears on the other hand, I have no real experience with. Can you carry a rifle or shotgun?
 
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When I lived in Alaska and was out in nature, bears didn't present much of an issue. They are pretty easily scared of by what they don't know. Most times if you could hear or see a bear, he saw or heard you long before you did. They key was to make noise and be seen. Pepper spray offers so little protection it isn't funny. The bear has to be right on top of you in order for you to spray him with it. They have very short range and bears are ridiculously fast. The bear won't hold still for you to shoot a little irritant in his face. Even if you were successful with the spray, all you would have is a really mad bear at this point. Take a good healthy walking stick with you and make noise. You don't need to be rediculous, but don't be stealthy. I always carried a gun of some kind, but never needed it.

There was on ongoing tale to tell the tourists who asked this very question. We would tell them to buy the pepper spray and some cat bells that you put on a cat's collar. This way you were making noise out in the woods. It was always good to know what kind of bears are out there, so we would educate them on the bear scat. Black bear scat was greasy and was in a pile similar to a cow patty. Grizzly bear scat smelled like pepper and had little bells in it.
 

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Pepper spray offers so little protection it isn't funny. The bear has to be right on top of you in order for you to spray him with it. They have very short range and bears are ridiculously fast.
It does work wonders on coyotes though.... Which is he more likely to run into?

There was on ongoing tale to tell the tourists who asked this very question. We would tell them to buy the pepper spray and some cat bells that you put on a cat's collar. This way you were making noise out in the woods. It was always good to know what kind of bears are out there, so we would educate them on the bear scat. Black bear scat was greasy and was in a pile similar to a cow patty. Grizzly bear scat smelled like pepper and had little bells in it.
When I lived up in Maine people used to hike with a handgun in case they ran into a bear. We used to suggest that they remove the front sight. That always got a puzzled look from people until you'd explain that it would be a lot less painful when that handgun was being removed from their butt. A .38 special isn't going to slow down your average bear...
 

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My only time to be around bears was also in Alaska. I was in an area where salmon were spawning at the time. Saw a momma and her cubs, and several big boys catching salmon. (Wasn't much "catching" to it, as it was in the spawning "hole", and the salmon were dying anyway.)) I saw them, and am sure they knew I was there, but kept my distance. They didn't give me much of a second thought, with the easy meals available. And I never was close enough to be a real threat to the cubs, so momma just noted I was there.

I've never had a fear of wildlife, but did show them respect. What Jason posted from his experience living in AK, I guess my experience was the norm.

This thread made me think of this video...

 

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I have a cottage which is located in the woods about 3/4 of a mile from the township road. Every day I do three return trips. There are many deer here in the winter which attract coyotes. My neighbour (who gets up much earlier than I) has seen fishers in the early hours also. I had bear tracks at my place about 7 years ago to boot.
I take my 27 pound corgi with me on a leash. How can I protect us from an attack? I'd love to be able to have a handgun but carrying one here isn't allowed. Suggestions?
id be more concerned about the bigfoot....
 

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The only contact I had with bears is with Yogi and Smokey. Oh, and Gentle Ben.:knownothing:
 
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Bear species and location can really vary. Around here we have a large Black Bear population - actually one of the most dense populations of the state. They are very docile and timid here - unless of course you come across a mama bear and her cubs.

The coyotes around here will mostly be alone except during a bad winter they will pack up to hunt together. Coyotes are also very timid unless they are starving during a bad winter. A small handgun will dispatch a coyote fairly easily, but will do nothing for a Black Bear but to piss them off.

As was said already - walk your dog on a leash and also make some noise now and then (every couple minutes) and you'll be fine. The coyotes and bear will do whatever they can to avoid you unless you corner them.
 

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I would think you are fairly safe but a can of bear spray and some thing to help make noise to alert an animal that you are coming so you don't spoke it.


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I remember a story about a bear in S. Utah that only attacked women... Locally he was known as "Genital Ben", I'm pretty sure it's a true story.

When using "bear, dog, human deterrent" capsicom sprays, to be effective you should make sure your attacker is DOWNWIND. I had a run-in with a pair of rottweilers while biking in the woods, got the first one square-no problem. A gust of wind ruined my adrenalin fueled aim at the second one and it was "a draw". Eight mile ride home was torture!
 

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Discussion Starter #12
When I lived in Alaska and was out in nature, bears didn't present much of an issue. They are pretty easily scared of by what they don't know. Most times if you could hear or sear a bear, he saw or heard you long before you did. They key was to make noise and be seen. Pepper spray offers so little protection it isn't funny. The bear has to be right on top of you in order for you to spray him with it. They have very short range and bears are ridiculously fast. The bear won't hold still for you to shoot a little irritant in his face. Even if you were successful with the spray, all you would have is a really mad bear at this point. Take a good healthy walking stick with you and make noise. You don't need to be rediculous, but don't be stealthy. I always carried a gun of some kind, but never needed it.

There was on ongoing tale to tell the tourists who asked this very question. We would tell them to buy the pepper spray and some cat bells that you put on a cat's collar. This way you were making noise out in the woods. It was always good to know what kind of bears are out there, so we would educate them on the bear scat. Black bear scat was greasy and was in a pile similar to a cow patty. Grizzly bear scat smelled like pepper and had little bells in it.
Very funny. I'm glad that we only have black bears here! I've never seen bear scat so I find your description of it useful and interesting. thanks.
 

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The coyotes won't bother you. They won't bother your dog either, if on leash with you. If you allow your dog to roam free, then it can become coyote food. Not an issue for a larger dog, but could be for a Corgi, with coyotes being a pack.

Put your mind at ease. I have 4 different packs of coyotes near me, and can tell each pack by the noises they make when out hunting. My dogs remain in a securely fenced yard around the house, unless they are next to me or indoors, but my largest one now is 22 pounds.

Smaller dogs are likely to become prey for owls, hawks and falcons, even in the yard, so I never let smaller dogs out alone during the times of peak hunting of birds of prey.

Welcome to the country!! You will soon learn to enjoy the lifestyle, and know what is safe, and what requires worry.

Bears on the other hand, I have no real experience with. Can you carry a rifle or shotgun?
Thanks for your experience Farmgirl. I probably worry needlessly as I haven't had close contact with them. I live on a point of land which juts into the a lake and I often hear packs of coyotes communicating across the water.
I couldn't use a rifle or shotgun very well as I have my girl on a leash.
 

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Coyotes can and will kill small dogs.

I spend a lot of time in Wisconsin's north woods and have only once had a coyote chaise my Boykin Spaniel. I have encountered black bears a few times. I have had a couple of bears stand on their hind legs and size me up, then walk away. Not a big deal.

We also have wolves, these critters are why I always carry some type of a gun with me when in the woods.
 

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I remember a story about a bear in S. Utah that only attacked women... Locally he was known as "Genital Ben", I'm pretty sure it's a true story.

When using "bear, dog, human deterrent" capsicom sprays, to be effective you should make sure your attacker is DOWNWIND. I had a run-in with a pair of rottweilers while biking in the woods, got the first one square-no problem. A gust of wind ruined my adrenalin fueled aim at the second one and it was "a draw". Eight mile ride home was torture!

"Genital Ben", some pretty funny stories on these forums lately! Takes the pain of all this cold and snow away, even if for a brief few.. Keep em commin! We have multiple black bears in our area and last fall, the wife says to me, Jeff, there's a bear coming up on the porch. I said, sure there is and get up from my nice warm comfortable recliner to look see,, here's this 350lb bear climbing the stairs. Without even thinking I go out on the porch and the thing just looks at me like,, what the hell is this! I said; you better get back to where you came from and the bear starts wagging it's head back and forth, and for a second I said I am screwed.. Then it takes off so fast down the hill and into he briars, I then realized there is no way a human can outrun a bear... Oh ya, we had two juveniles last fall bowling with my pumpkins from the garden, and throwing them in the woods, one of them climbed over the gate like it knew that's where you get in. Had an game camera pointed in that direction set for 24 hour pictures,, funny I didn't get any of the bears but sure got a lot of me mowing the grass... Good luck with your bear and coyote issues. Coyotes around here come right up to the house in search of kitties, the wife takes care of them in quick fashion, the bears, they are very timid but they get brave when food is in short order for them, keep pic-a-nic baskets in your house too, they love those.
 

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Thanks for your experience Farmgirl. I probably worry needlessly as I haven't had close contact with them. I live on a point of land which juts into the a lake and I often hear packs of coyotes communicating across the water.
I couldn't use a rifle or shotgun very well as I have my girl on a leash.
The coyotes usually sound closer than they are. Can't tell you how many times I have grabbed the rifle when hearing them, convinced they were within 50 feet of the house, and they are much farther away in the woods. But, I still get up, hoping to thin their numbers down, just so that I can get a little sleep at night, since they are quiet once you get one of the pack.

And yes, if your dog is trained to walk on leash, and not pull, you can use a shotgun or rifle when walking the dog. The reason dogs "heel" on the left side is because you carry the rifle or shotgun on your right side. If you are left handed, train your dog to the other side.
 

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'Yotes go for the easy stuff. It's a risk/reward thing with them on everything.

If they are confident about taking down a critter without injury or burning more energy than they will gain, they will.
If they size up a critter, and there is less risky chow available, they will opt out, and go after the easier snack...every time.

The trick is to never be the easy snack, and having the local 'yotes educated about your area being too risky to bother with in the first place.
They respect each others territory as a pack, and mark boundary's to that effect.

Keep the .22 handy and start shooting them on sight, and leave the carcass wedged in a lower tree limb or on a fence.
After 2-3 they get the hint, and you wont see them close enough to get a shot for many months.;)
They aren't stupid.

In your area, like ours, you also have the Coyote/Wolf Hybrids. They are more brazen, and will go after large livestock when chow gets scarce, and make a habit of going after lager dogs. I have watched a pair Jackaling a family of cross country Skiers on the trail, by running parallel and behind in the brush line, while sizing up the two kids.
When winter runs long and the younger Deer, rabbits, mice, and voles start getting scarce, the pressure forces them to consider more risk.

Part of shooting several a year, is reducing pressure on the chow species, so there is more for the other 'yotes, and they stay healthier longer, so they don't have to risk taking a dog, or go after a Kid.

The Hybrids are NOT anything like the scrawny little 25lb scrub 'yotes in our lower Midwest, western and southern states.
They run 50-70lb's and take adult Deer down regularly. They also like to lure large dogs away from the threat of the house, and into the wood line where several 'yotes will attack and kill them.

They will and do attack Horses, and other livestock if they aren't "Educated". Just recently a couple of attacks on horses made the news here.
One horse ended up being put down from injury's.

I'd put a sling on the .22 rifle and take it with you, until you get them used to the idea of respecting your boundrys, or ending up like "Fred and Ralph" hanging in the Maple.

Bear spray works if they are real close, but the problem with bear spray is, if you don't play the wind right, you get a dose yourself, and that's a hell of time to be blinded. It's better to take a shot and maybe miss at a distance, as they will understand the risk factor for them is a lot higher than they planned on.
 

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This incident happened about 3 weeks ago in a rural area north of Detroit.
Did coyote pack attack a police horse?
Yep.

And a week later the 'Yotes went after another horse, at the same place.
Folks down around that area, tend to be City thinkers. They should have been shooting a long time ago, but it's not really a popular or PC thing to do in that particular area. I'm not even going to mention trapping..

The Same DNR denied that breeding populations of Coyotes existed in S.E. Mich. in the 80's...when they planted them.
Same DNR that denied breeding populations of mountain lions existed in SW mich, after multiple attacks on horses, photographs, tracks, and expert witnesses..until multiple Females with Kits were caught on trail cameras.

The Coywolves have been here for a long time now.
Anybody that traps, noticed them in the late 90's.;)
 

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I carry a XDM 3.8 , .45acp in my coat pocket . If I Couldn't have a concealed handgun. I would carry a light weight 12ga on a sling over my shoulder.

Even if it wasn't legal to do so I would still carry a concealed hand gun. Who's going to know you have one.:dunno:
 
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