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PTO clutch - when and why do they go bad

7482 Views 17 Replies 9 Participants Last post by  x738
I am sure this has been covered a thousand times. From my weak search skills, most conversations I found were 5 years old or more.

Background info; X540 has 220 hours, lived at the beach for a couple years, PTO clutch was replaced 1 year ago.

The story: I just bought this from my FIL a couple months ago. Have done some light cutting with it and I really like it. So I figured I would push it a little and see what it can do. I ran it back down some of the trails on my property and cut a small 1 acre area. I usually cut this with a bush hog, but honestly, the X540 did an excellent job and didn't seem to push it too hard. So I decided to take the trip a little further... and started cutting trails I have through the woods. This really is more a test of where I can drive the mower and really not hard on the deck at all, mowing is pretty light with a few small tree sprouts here and there. Everything went good and the mower did excellent for this work but I did have to lock the rear wheels many times to get down the trails.

When I finished, on my way back to the barn (not running the blades) I have to climb a pretty steep hill, maybe 200' long and 25-35' of elevation change. When I made it to the top of the hill, I mean right at the crest of the hill, the engine loaded up, started bogging, squeaked and shut down. Starter would not turn it over. My first thought was oh crap, I just burnt up the motor and it locked up. I had been mowing about 2 hours and thought I overheated it and she locked up. Fortunately that wasn't the case, it was only the PTO clutch went bad. Which brings me to my questions;

In my nearly 30 years of running a mower with electric PTO clutch I have never had this happen. I always thought this was an excellent design with very few problems, WAY better than the old school moving a big lever to engage a belt that turns the blades. My old X324 went almost 20 years without a failure... only squeaking, so I replaced it.

Has anyone else experienced a failure like this? There was no warning of a potential failure, it just locked up, shut the mower down and called it quits.

Do the PTO clutches give us any hints they are going bad? Or do they typically just give up and die a quick death?

When I removed the PTO clutch, it did fall apart, I didn't see any broken parts, but there was a lot of scale and loose dust/debris that fell out. I ordered a new John Deere PTO clutch. There are aftermarket clutches, but the X324 lasted so long I figured go back OEM. My thought is the beach environment must be super harsh on these, possibly why it had been replaced once before. And not knowing what was installed on it, the replacement may have been an aftermarket item... The X540 is a solid piece, I really like it and it works great cutting my trails, but will keep it on the dry trails only. Waiting on the new clutch now, should be here this week.
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An electric pto has 2 different common failure modes: windings and pulley bearing. Other than common, mechanical damage is possible, but seldom.

Windings failure: As current passes through windings, the wire gets hot and expands. When finished using the pto, wires cool down and contract. The movement scrapes the thin varnish type insulation from the wires and the wires short out against one another. The strength of an electro magnet is determined by the number of coils and the amperage in the wires. With the wires shorting out, there are fewer coils and the magnet has less strength. When the wires short, this also reduces the total resistance of windings and allows more current to flow through often resulting in overloading you electrical system and/or blowing a fuse. Typically, you'll want about 4 ohms resistance in your windings. You can often have that when the windings are "cold"/not expanded, but it may change/get reduced when the windings warm/expand and short.

Pulley bearing failure: I believe this is your situation. When pto is engaged, the pulley is rotating at the same rpm as the crankshaft and the bearing inside the pulley is just there to take up space. When pto is turned "Off", the pulley should stop rotating, but with the crankshaft still rotating in /with the bearing. There're springs in the clutch disc that pull the disc back against the metal housing and act a a "brake". When pto is turned "On", the magnetic force of the windings overcome the springs and the clutch engages. When turned "Off" the disc springs back against the housing and prevents the blades (or whatever is attached to pto) from free wheeling.

I'm thinking either a bearing failure or possibly some of the loose debris you found inside got into the bearing and locked it up. I'm not familiar with the exact makeup of your clutch, but you should have bearing inside of the pulley. Replacing this bearing could give you a spare pto clutch!

Hopefully, you've got a better feel of what's going on inside your clutch! Bob
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I have my Grandfather's Power King tractor (he bought new in 1976), his Yazoo mower (he bought new in 1971), and three Cub Cadet mowers (1979, 2005, 2016), all have original PTO clutches.
Were you mowing uphill or just had PTO on?
Mine I only run PTO mowing, and try "giving it a rest", mow a couple hours at a time.
I'd make sure mower spindles spin free. I'm thinking a load on PTO is what shortens the life.

Sent from my SM-S205DL using Tapatalk
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A friend had some series with the electric clutch.....faiur sized unit but it was just a big mower..not quite a tractor but close

For some reason his was getting hot...hardly had any lawn.

When it got hot the glue for the magnets or whatever let go and ....the end.

seemed like they were 300 bucks +-
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I have no idea if this applies to the x540, but some pto clutches also have a 'brake' function.

On - and the pulley is connected to / driven by the output shaft of the motor.
Off - the pulley is connected to the frame so (blade) rotation is quickly stopped.

Off position is typically spring powered so the 'braking' function does not require electric power and a function coil.
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I wasnt complaining about the design or longevity of the clutches, I do understand how they work. But that explanation was far better than I could put into words, thank you.

I was just surprised by the failure, these have nearly a 20 year rock solid history with me. I was just blown away that the clutch failed and locked up the engine. So what must have happened internally on mine was the "disk" froze to the "basket" or outer shell of the clutch. Since the "basket" is restrained from rotation by a rod to the frame, it shut the engine down and froze it solid. X738 mentioned the braking function, I am leaning towards a brake function failure in my particular clutch, that is probably why it locked the engine down. I could not turn the engine over by hand. Once I pulled the clutch off, engine fired right up...

I was really just curious if anyone else ever had something like this happen or if this was a unicorn event. It happened so quick I thought for a moment I needed an underwear change, seriously sounded like a catastrophic engine failure. If the clutches do fail often, curiosity makes me question if they give us a warning or just crap out...

If you go on Amazon or Ebay and type in your mower make and model, you will get hits on the PTO clutch, so I assumed it was a common failure / high replacement item. And there is a large aftermarket contingent for them, Extreme and E8 appear to be big players in the industry. Side note: my JD OEM clutch came today :)
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My 2009 X540 with 400 hrs. is still on the original PTO.
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Sometimes pto failures give some advanced warnings, but usually not, they just stop working. A failing coil will start blowing fuses or sometime slip. Bearing failure can SOMETIMES be noticed by a squealing sound when pto is "Off". A bad/failing bearing can also be detected by wiggling the pulley...should be no wiggle... but belt tension or belt must be removed to check. Bob
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Am I correct that it was the 2nd PTO clutch on your machine that failed? Two PTO clutch failures within 220 hours of total machine use between the clutch you mentioned which was replaced a year ago and now this one? That's not normal.

You also mentioned the "machine lived at the beach" before you got it. The natural lift in the cutting action would draw sand and other abrasives up swirling around while using the machine. Obviously, that environment would be harder on rotating parts with bearings than would an environment with less abrasives around. I highly doubt your FIL "cut the sand" with the mower, but still, in that beach environment, sand tends to be around much more and on solid surfaces, etc. more so than it would be away from the beach or another sandy area.

Was the PTO clutch which just failed, a OEM replacement part or was it an aftermarket part? Often, as you mentioned, there are a couple of suppliers of those parts and they are picked up across the spectrum. However, replacing two PTO clutches in such a short time of machine use isn't common.........
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Agreed, I think the sand killed it. When I got it from my FIL, he gave the folder he had for it. There was a receipt that showed the clutch was replaced about a year ago. So correct, this will be the second replacement clutch. I have no idea if what I replaced was OEM or aftermarket.

I got it all together last night and everything is a-okay and super smooth and quiet. :)
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Take a look at your old clutch and try to figure out how/if pulley end can be removed. If JD type, typically Ogura or Warner, three nuts and it's in 2 pieces! If pulley end can be removed, you may be able to replace the bearing and have a spare when you need it... prolly 15 years down the road! Bob
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I'm curious if the clutch is getting engaged at full speed or at idle?
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good question about engine speed.

Honestly I may not do this correctly, I typically engage at a mid to higher RPM on this mower, the big deck will stall the "small" engine if idling.
On my ZT, I engage at a low RPM...

On a Blue Collar Tour theme, I wont go in to how big my deck is, I do like to keep my deck clean and wash it often, sometimes when I go to use my deck the engine struggles to get my deck it up to speed, once its revved up, my deck works good. :ROFLMAO:
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Rides, You already know this, so this is for others that may not!

It's best for the pto to engage at the lowest rpm without stalling the engine. This wears the clutch plates less, and not having to restart wears the starter less. BUT! If that happens to be 3/4 throttle, so be it. THAT'S the minimum/lowest rpm! Some Operator Manuals for some tractors state, 'Engage pto at max rpm.' Personally I don't believe in this, but that's the Manual! Bob
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BUT! If that happens to be 3/4 throttle, so be it. THAT'S the minimum/lowest rpm! Some Operator Manuals for some tractors state, 'Engage pto at max rpm.'
Yes, the x540 requires full or near full throttle to engage the PTO UNLESS you can learn to use the choke before engaging! My x540 engages the PTO at idle if I use half choke when engaging. At idle move the choke to before it slows the engine and then engage.
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Yes, the x540 requires full or near full throttle to engage the PTO UNLESS you can learn to use the choke before engaging! My x540 engages the PTO at idle if I use half choke when engaging. At idle move the choke to before it slows the engine and then engage.
WOW, we think alike, I actually tried some choke yesterday when I got it back together, I wasn't successful, but it was close... I will tweak my method to yours and see how we do. thanks!

RW I am with you, any kind of equipment (less racecars :)) it is ALWAYS best to engage a clutch at the lowest RPM. I worked construction years ago, we bought a very large diesel powered hydro-seeder. The first time a crew tried to operate it they revved the engine and threw the lever to engage the clutch to the agitator in a full tank of water... and exploded the clutch, $5,000.00 mistake. I was not there but the equipment salesman was...
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Did you try and OHM it out to see if it was a coil failure?
It's about smooth engagement, without thumping/banging or whatever the term is.

Mine not an x590, but it engages much smoother at the recommended full rpm.

I was quite surprised when I figured this out (and also learned it was Deere's recommendation for many of the machines).

I've also run many off-highway machines over the years that produce much more gentle engages at lower rpm.
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