[robpm]

This is a continuation of this post http://www.greentractortalk.com/forums/showthread.php?3220-New-to-the-forum regarding changing of antifreeze and I thought that it probably is best to continue it here. The manual on the 990 states the following when draining and flushing the system:


Draining Cooling System
1. Park machine safely. (See Parking Safely in the SAFETY section.)
2. Allow engine to cool.
3. Raise hood and latch open.
4. Remove right side panel.
5. Slowly open radiator cap (A) to the first stop to release all pressure.
6. Close radiator cap tightly.
7. Open radiator petcock (B) and drain coolant into a pan.
8. Loosen engine block drain plug (C) and allow all coolant to drain into a pan.
9. When coolant drains from the recovery tank, remove radiator cap.
10. Close radiator petcock and install engine block drain plug.
11. Flush cooling system.


Flushing Cooling System
1. Fill cooling system with clean water and John Deere Cooling System Cleaner, or John Deere Cooling System Quick Flush or an equivalent. Follow directions on the can.
2. Install and tighten radiator cap.
3. Start and run engine until it reaches operating temperature.
4. Stop engine.
5. Open radiator petcock and remove engine block drain plug.
6. Drain cooling system immediately before rust and dirt settle.
7. Close radiator petcock and install engine block drain plug.

Now it states to use John Deere Cooling System Cleaner or John Deere Cooling System Quick Flush or an Equivalent

I cannot find any products like these on JD's site nor anywhere else. In a searchI came up with a guy talking about this stuff called Restore and Restore Plus which he bought at a local John Deere dealer for his Cummins Diesel which was having some overheating problems. You can find its description here http://www.fleetguard.com/pdfs/product_lit/emea_brochures/LI33024-GB.pdf

So my question is should I use something like this Restore stuff or will Prestone Super Radiator Flush work and not cause any problems. I just want to make sure that I would not do any damage using the Prestone stuff or should I use something specific for Diesel engines?

Thanks for the help.

Rob

 

[Kennyd]

I can't imagine with the low hours on your machine you need any sort of "flush" product. I would just change the coolant and move on to the next project...

 

[RandyM]

Kenny, it is not just hours of use but, time also. I don't know how old his machine is but rust and corrosion can still build up over time. Though just a coolant change can go a long way to keep the maintenance issues to a minimum.

Rob, if you are still concerened and want to flush the system here is what I found on JDParts. Hope this helps.:empathy3:

Oh, and I almost forgot. I had a couple of cars that had gone quite a while without a coolant change. When I finally got around to it I flushed them both and added new coolant. It wasn't long after and one car's water pump seal went and then the other's heater core. Not saying this will happen to you but, man things happen.

 

[robpm]

Randy, thanks for the input. Yes I appreciate what Kenny wrote but you are correct it is not only hours but time. The 990 is 6 years old if not maybe 7 depending on when it was manufactured in that year being a 2005 model. The fluid was never changed. So it needs to be changed and of course it has sat. The manual also states to flush it with a John Deere flush which I could not find. The document on the Restore Plus that you gave matches the link on the product that I found on the web.

Now to find a place where I can find it locally or over the web. What I have seen thus far is you have to buy a case of it and I don't want to purchase a case of it. I need it for one flush. In addition it looks like the Plus is the way to go although I really don't know what silicate gel is although I am guessing it may have something to do with Diesel but again it is a guess. The other stuff like rust etc that the Pro works better on seems to be the way to go.

I am learning that a Diesel engine requires different things than a gas engine. So it eats a lot of time trying to research it and find what is right. Maybe these are some things to put on the forum for those just coming in that would be real helpful to people and a time saver when one is having to research. That is why I did all the pictures on the cleaning of the suction screen. To me if someone had that before would have helped me to see what to expect and what needs to be done.

I don't want to just go off and do something and then later find out you have damaged your tractor which has long term consequences and of course added to that is money.

Thanks

Rob

 

[dieselshadow]

FWIW, I've seen the Restore and Prestone radiator flush products at most automotive parts places such as Napa, O'Rielly, Advance, and AutoZone.


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[Gizmo2]

I would say if it has not been flushed out in 7 years I would leave well enough alone. IMO, If a good antifreeze and distilled water were used (in there now) things should be fine.
I drain and install new liquid when I need to, bad hose, water pump etc. Also IMO, It's the adding of tap water that will cause most problems.

 

[RandyM]

I am learning that a Diesel engine requires different things than a gas engine. So it eats a lot of time trying to research it and find what is right. Maybe these are some things to put on the forum for those just coming in that would be real helpful to people and a time saver when one is having to research. That is why I did all the pictures on the cleaning of the suction screen. To me if someone had that before would have helped me to see what to expect and what needs to be done.

I don't want to just go off and do something and then later find out you have damaged your tractor which has long term consequences and of course added to that is money.

Thanks

Rob

I hear you Rob, completely on every issue. I am learning right along with ya. :good2:

You've gone a long way in helping someone else with your suction screen and now coolant posts. We are extremely greatful. Bear in mind though, we have to start some where and these are all great starts. We would not be opposed to filing any detailed "How to" articles in the library. Should someone want to submit them as others have done. Take a look there at the formats used for examples. We can make any thread a sticky also, should it warrant. Though I hesitate on going over board on stickies. Keep up the good work everyone. :thumbup1gif:

 

[RRMCCABE]

I think coolant technologies have improved greatly over the years. If my coolant looks good (green without oxidation) I leave it alone.

I am a stickler for service on vehicles but a flush is something I never do.

 

[robpm]

I have tried to find the Restore and Restore Plus products today on and off. Cummins Diesel and Ryder Fleet Products sell it. Cummins through its dealers. I called one dealer and they did not have any. Ryder has it on their web site but they are out of stock. It looks like I can get it from Getgreenparts.com at least they show it in stock. They show the part number but then they call it a shop cleaner so I have sent them off an email to verify that the part number PMCC2638 that they have listed is truly the Restore Plus flush.

I did check all the automotive stores as suggested and none of their web sites list the Restore or Restore Plus product. It seems to me this stuff is pretty hard to find and it isn't very inexpensive either. The Ryder store has it for $28 a gallon and the list price from JD is $41.56 and the getgreenparts.com has a price of $34.63. With shipping costs it just might be wisest to order it from the local dealer if this is the stuff I should use but I will wait to see. Shipping gets it to my door instead of having to drive a 30 mile round trip and the hour plus included in time.

Some may think that I am doing over kill by flushing the system and maybe I am. I guess I would rather be safe than sorry by following the book and have the system in peak condition when I really start to work it. That way it will have all new fluids and filters to start off with and hopefully everything will be done by the book instead of half done. Granted I don't have any warranty to worry about but I do know from experience if you take care of your equipment it will take care of you. As the old saying goes, an ounce of prevention saves or prevents a pound of cure. If this JD 990 (Yanmar) is all that it is cracked up to be as a tractor and can last 50 years then I am looking forward to getting my next 20 years Lord willing out of it and then maybe my sons or someone else getting the next 30 out of it.

Thanks for all the comments and input. I greatly appreciate it.

Randy I will try to put something together on this as well with pictures etc since I am going to change out the thermostat following what the book says.

By the way I attached my upgraded bucket with hook and new wear plates last night and also put on the Bro-Tek thumb. It was to dark to get good pictures so Lord willing come Friday I will take some pictures and post them after that.

Rob

 

[eepete]

I changed the coolant in my generator in 2009. When I had the test done on it fall of 2011, it needed some additive. Prior to that, no problems and it was a change every 5 years or so. My guess is a "weak" batch of antifreeze.

I have the oil changed and antifreeze tested each year on the fire dept. generator. It had an antifreeze change in 2009 too, and needed some additive. Oil was great. Got a lot of grief about the cost of the oil testing from the good 'ol boys. I path the guy who does to work to send my generator stuff off and test it at the same time.

This last year, we had a $10K rebuild on our 1st out engine because of diesel in the oil. All bearings changed, new pumps, etc. Guess what. Now everyone thinks that the oil testing is the best thing since sliced bread.

I want to get in the habit of testing the oil and antifreeze on my diesel tractors each year. Anyone got a pointer/name of a good testing place? It's one more little thing to do, but I think I'm a believer...

- pete

 

[has15]

I changed the coolant in my generator in 2009. When I had the test done on it fall of 2011, it needed some additive. Prior to that, no problems and it was a change every 5 years or so. My guess is a "weak" batch of antifreeze.

I have the oil changed and antifreeze tested each year on the fire dept. generator. It had an antifreeze change in 2009 too, and needed some additive. Oil was great. Got a lot of grief about the cost of the oil testing from the good 'ol boys. I path the guy who does to work to send my generator stuff off and test it at the same time.

This last year, we had a $10K rebuild on our 1st out engine because of diesel in the oil. All bearings changed, new pumps, etc. Guess what. Now everyone thinks that the oil testing is the best thing since sliced bread.

I want to get in the habit of testing the oil and antifreeze on my diesel tractors each year. Anyone got a pointer/name of a good testing place? It's one more little thing to do, but I think I'm a believer...

- pete

I am not sure but the dealer may have the sample jars and the ability to do the testing or know where to have it done. When I was working as a operator we sent our samples strait to the CAT or Kumatsu service dept. Hope this helps.

 

[dieselshadow]

Cummins sells test strips for coolant and prepaid oil sample test bottles. JD might have a similar program.


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[robpm]

eepete, I didn't know that you could do things like that regarding the oil and antifreeze. I knew that you can get these little things that look like turkey basters and they tell you something about the antifreeze but it seems to me you are talking testing that tells you something about the chemical make up of it. That does sound interesting.

Well here is an update for everyone on my antifreeze change. Trying to come up with the Restore and Restore Plus was not an easy thing. I decided to call the mega dealership which was connected with the www.getgreenparts.com website. They have about 7 dealerships in Michigan. I called their main headquarters and had to leave a message for service. I had my call returned promptly and the service guy told me that they only do ag tractors. He told me that I should not use the antifreeze used for gasoline engines etc and I told him that I had already bought the JD Coolguard II but that I was trying to figure out if I should use a flush with the two products that JD sells. He gave me a name of a service guy in one of their other dealerships where they sell CUT's. I then called and was able to speak with this individual. He told me that with only 174 hours on the tractor he would not change the antifreeze unless it was starting to get milky and not clear in color or if it was getting a brown color to it. I then asked him about what the manual stated about changing it at 2000 hrs or 2 yrs. he reiterated what he had already stated. He then told me that he would not use Restore or Restore Plus unless there was actual calcium build up or there was chunks of stuff floating in the fluid. He said if I changed it he would flush it with water until it was clear and then add the new antifreeze.

I had not yet really looked at the color of the antifreeze yet. So then I brought the 990 to the driveway and opened the hood and removed the radiator cap. it was green but it had more of a milkiness to the green instead of a clearer green. Since I had the antifreeze and it had not been changed in at least 6 years I decided to do it. I drained it. I liked the drain on the radiator. it was not the normal petcock which I am use to and which was in the picture in the manual. It had a hose to it and then a plastic threaded petcock which worked well. The block drain was nice as well being all brass. I saw only a couple of very small pieces of rust that came out of the system. Once I drained it I then filled it with distilled H2O and let it run and then let it sit and drained it again. I did this 2 more times so that there was no more green tinted water coming out. Each time I let it heat up to temp and then let it sit and then drained it. Once that was complete I removed the old thermostat and put in the new one with a new gasket. The inside of the aluminum head was crystal clean which you can see in the pictures. The new Coolguard II has a green tint but not quite so green. it was also very clear so that you could look through it easily to the bottom of the container. The stuff I had just removed you could not see through it. So that task is done and I am glad that I did it. I believe this will save some effort on the other end.

Thanks for all your input and advice. Some of you had already told me that you would just flush it with water and that worked well. It was helpful to talk with this specific service guy. He seemed to know what he was talking about.

The last thing to do is to check the gear oil in the front wheel drive. The manual says not to change this until the 500 hr mark. So I am guessing that I am safe here. I am just going to check it and make sure it is full.

Then maybe I can start to work with it. I am looking forward to it.

Below are some pictures on changing out the thermostat. I had to take my pocket knife to clean the old gasket off from both sides. I am glad that I changed this out as well.

Rob

 

[Kennyd]

I want to get in the habit of testing the oil and antifreeze on my diesel tractors each year. Anyone got a pointer/name of a good testing place? It's one more little thing to do, but I think I'm a believer...

- pete

I have personally used Blackstone Labs in years past, they are very well regarded in the diesel truck forums as well.

 

[Kennyd]

Nice pictures Rob:thumbup1gif:

 

[dieselshadow]

Great post Rob! Thanks for the pictures and tutorial. :thumbup1gif: Looks like you got a real nice tractor by looking at how clean the engine is:good2:

 

[robpm]

Dieselshadow, Yes I providentially obtained a real nice tractor. It is just like brand new and really has hardly been used and yet it is 6 almost 7 y/o.

Well this is an update and follow up on the radiator fluid change and the thermostat change. I had a conference to attend last night so I was rushing to get the job done. And I truly thought that I was done. However, I didn't remember that there was also a lower gasket which goes below the thermostat that I had purchased as well. When I took some more time this morning and really looked at the pictures I had taken I could see that I had not fully removed all of the old gasket material from the top gasket and then I could see that there was the lower gasket still there as well. I had to attend a continuation of the same conference again this morning so when I got back late this afternoon I went back to the tractor. I drained the fluid out of the radiator only. I had the original container still and it is easy with the petcock on the radiator to drain directly into a bottle. I have to say that this is a great feature. This way I could keep the fluid clean and be able to put it back. I figured that it would drain below the thermostat which it did. Then I pulled off the top hose once again and then removed the cover to the thermostat and pulled out the thermostat and sure enough one could see that there was this old lower gasket which was adhered to the aluminum as well. This time I used a razor blade to remove the rest of the old top gasket that was left and then used a tiny screw driver to scrape out the lower gasket. Then the final cleaning job was using fine sandpaper to complete the removal of both gaskets. I folded the sand paper up and used the corner of it to get into the shelf where the lower gasket sat. I had once again stuffed the area where the thermostat sits with a paper towel in order to make sure none of the old gasket mateial fell down into the area and also used my small shop vac to suck it all up before pulling the paper towel out of the hole. Once completed I put it all back together using the lower gasket for underneath the thermostat, installed the thermostat and then the upper gasket and then the thermostat cover and then the upper radiator hose. I have added some more pictures of the process. Once complete I put the CoolGuard II fluid back into the radiator that I had drained out. Started the engine and let it run to warm up and checked for leaks. I could not see any. This time I can say that the job was truly complete. I should have had more time than I did to complete the job in the first place. So another lesson learned over again!

I will seek to put all the pictures up on Picassa for any who would want to see all the pictures

Rob

 

[robpm]

Here is the actual schematic of the thermostat for the 990 CUT along with a couple of additional pictures showing the radiator drain attached to the side of the engine and also the drain for the engine block. You can see all the pictures here https://picasaweb.google.com/116078...ndThermostatChange?authuser=0&feat=directlink

Rob