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Discussion Starter #1
As I creep closer to groundbreaking on my new shop, I keep contemplating alternative energy strategies.

I'm actually wondering about using ground water to augment my air conditioning via forced air radiators fed via my well pump. Or maybe just one radiator added into the furnace air handler stack.

Thoughts?
 

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As I creep closer to groundbreaking on my new shop, I keep contemplating alternative energy strategies.

I'm actually wondering about using ground water to augment my air conditioning via forced air radiators fed via my well pump. Or maybe just one radiator added into the furnace air handler stack.

Thoughts?

It is an expensive, wasteful way to cool, but it would work. The VA hospital in Minneapolis used to cool that way back in the day. That was when water was free.:laugh:
How many GPM is your pump? if you figure your well water is 50 deg going into the coil and say 55 going out (if your lucky), you will find that you need to pump allot of water to get significant BTU's.
If you have a purpose for the water, then it would make sense to get something out of it.
 

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Since you will have a small temperature differential,, you will need an enormous radiator surface area,,,

IMHO,, to start,, you will need a half dozen 600 HP truck radiators,,, :good2:

Less than that, you will not notice any effect,,,:flag_of_truce:

The other negative is that this water cooling system will remove VERY little moisture from the air,,

lower humidity is what really makes you feel comfortable,,,
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Radiators are cheap. :laugh:

I'll be doing something for dehumidification as well. In fact, using well water to condense the humidity might just be the way to go.
 

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Water cooled AC

It is an expensive, wasteful way to cool, but it would work. The VA hospital in Minneapolis used to cool that way back in the day. That was when water was free.:laugh:
How many GPM is your pump? if you figure your well water is 50 deg going into the coil and say 55 going out (if your lucky), you will find that you need to pump allot of water to get significant BTU's.
If you have a purpose for the water, then it would make sense to get something out of it.
There are a number of AC units that both cool the air and heat water. Some dairy farms use those as they need a lot of hot water. The cool water first goes through a heat exchanger to cool the Freon. If you have a need for hot water, it's a pretty efficient way to cool air and warm water.

Treefarmer
 

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Discussion Starter #7
I guess I just see it as "almost free" BTUs.

Say the water comes out at 45° and we heat/cool to 70°. That's only a 25° delta on either end of the spectrum if I can harvest/dump the heat.

In January, when ambient is too cold for a heat pump by -20°f, bringing in 45° water is a big improvement. Might not seem like much, but I only "heat" the shop to 55° when I'm not working.
 

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There are a number of AC units that both cool the air and heat water. Some dairy farms use those as they need a lot of hot water. The cool water first goes through a heat exchanger to cool the Freon. If you have a need for hot water, it's a pretty efficient way to cool air and warm water.

Treefarmer
Your talking about a water cooled compressor...Jim is talking about single pass direct cooling with well water.
What your talking about is very common these days and works great when you can use the hot water.
 

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I guess I just see it as "almost free" BTUs.

Say the water comes out at 45° and we heat/cool to 70°. That's only a 25° delta on either end of the spectrum if I can harvest/dump the heat.

In January, when ambient is too cold for a heat pump by -20°f, bringing in 45° water is a big improvement. Might not seem like much, but I only "heat" the shop to 55° when I'm not working.
Why not get a water cooled heat pump?
I wouldn’t want to waste that much well water though. If you were irrigating or something like that, it makes sense to reject some heat into it, but pumping water just for single pass cooling is not economically feasible.
Have you priced a well lately?

I should do something with my spring... it spews 60gpm of ice cold water 24/7 and it just runs into the creek:dunno:
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Who said anything about single pass?

I've got (2) 22x40' walls I could line with pipes.

But what makes more sense is some kind of ducted fan which circulates indoor air through a core. I'll have (3) 8x4x40' cavities between upper/lower containers that could easily be outfitted to such a beast.
 

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Who said anything about single pass?

I've got (2) 22x40' walls I could line with pipes.

But what makes more sense is some kind of ducted fan which circulates indoor air through a core. I'll have (3) 8x4x40' cavities between upper/lower containers that could easily be outfitted to such a beast.
Single pass meaning “when it goes through your cooling setup, it gets dumped”.
Where would the water go after it goes through your coil and walls?
I’m guessing you would need somewhere around 10 gpm to get the cooling that you would get out of a window unit.
Automotive Radiators wouldn’t work very well...they are not designed for a 5-10 deg delta. They are designed for more like 30 or 40.
You need a coil with very fine tubing and fins...AKA a chilled water coil.
 

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Why not? If everything in the system is food-safe, where's the problem?
You better scrap the automotive radiator plan then:lolol:
3 problems:
1) it’s illegal
2) the small (relatively) amount of water at the bottom of your casing that is migrating in from the aquifer would quickly warm up from the recirculating.
3) the potential to contaminate your well.
 

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....ground source heat pump/geothermal heat pump....
orwhat ever its called in your part of the country...is by far the most efficient way to provide cooling...its less effecient for heat but it totally solves your ambient heat pump issues...i totally heat/cool via GS heat pump...home and shop..requires no outside unit either...


the other thing is....when you think you have enough insulation....double it.....then double it again.....its the cheapest most effective thermal support you can ever do for your building


this is a picture of the 5ton multistage heat pump unit ...the lineset going vertical from it goes to the air handler (split system)...it also makes hot water but it doesnt run enough to totally keep the hot water up so we use propane to supplement and to power a backup genset incase power goes out...my shop has a combo unit rafter hung (2nd pic)
 

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....ground source heat pump/geothermal heat pump....
orwhat ever its called in your part of the country...is by far the most efficient way to provide cooling...its less effecient for heat but it totally solves your ambient heat pump issues...i totally heat/cool via GS heat pump...home and shop..requires no outside unit either...


the other thing is....when you think you have enough insulation....double it.....then double it again.....its the cheapest most effective thermal support you can ever do for your building


this is a picture of the 5ton multistage heat pump unit ...the lineset going vertical from it goes to the air handler (split system)...it also makes hot water but it doesnt run enough to totally keep the hot water up so we use propane to supplement and to power a backup genset incase power goes out...my shop has a combo unit rafter hung (2nd pic)
What are you using for a ground source? A well field or horizontal buried piping?
 
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