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Discussion Starter #1
Well, the problems keep rolling in this year. So, went to hook up the mower deck for the second time this year, and the pto assembly took for ever to drop down. I figured it might just be a fluke, and would clear up with the weight of the deck to pull it down. Well, it's not any better. Takes 5-10 seconds to go from the H on the sticker, to the fully raised position. What's the best way to troubleshoot this? Can I pull the hose off and flush it somehow, in case its something in there? Drop the cylinder itself? Ideas?
 

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Have you tried adjusting the 3 point hitch drop speed control? Not sure where it is on the 1025r but on my 2038r it's under the seat. Assuming you have the "mechanical" lift for you MMM that is tied to the 3 point.


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Discussion Starter #3 (Edited)
Have you tried adjusting the 3 point hitch drop speed control? Not sure where it is on the 1025r but on my 2038r it's under the seat. Assuming you have the "mechanical" lift for you MMM that is tied to the 3 point.


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I wish it was that easy. We have the hydraulic system that uses a single acting cylinder to raise the deck. t's slowest going down, which is supposed to be spring (and gravity) assisted.
 

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The hydraulic life is power up but gravity down. is there a blockage in the line. Does it raise fine. Does it hook into loader control or is it the independent lift with the switch on the dash?
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Not the switch operated one. I think it must be something in the line at this point. I pulled the cylinder, and it seemed fine (they use a DA cylinder with a plug on the second port!), so the next step will be to pull the ends of the hose, and clean it out I guess.. Project for Monday, since I'm going out of town for the weekend
 

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Can you hook up the other side of the cylinder? That could hook into the other side of the curl function on your loader control then you would have power up and down. Which is what the new "Command Cut" is on the new 2 series. Good Luck Dont know if it can be done but if the cylinder has a plug it sounds doable to me>
 

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Just wondering , before removing the cylinder , did you happen to unplug the hyd connection and then plug in the connection again.. :dunno:

I've had hyd lift on several different JD sub compacts over the years. Of all the units I've always had to help lower the lift arms down for the MMM. :dunno: By using either my foot or hand pressing down on the lift arm at the same time moving the hyd lever.
 

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With the hydraulic mmm lift, when lowering the linkage alone without the mmm attached, the linkage will lower slowly. You also have to be careful to not push the SCV control to far to the right or you will get into the regen section.
If you do not have an auto connect, I can image it would almost take some assistance to get the linkage alone to lower. The only thing that pulls the linkage down is gravity and a spring connected to the linkage at the lift cylinder.

Also, the cylinder port isn't plugged, that is a vent.

I have an auto connect and when I lower the linkage without the mmm attached, I always give it lots of time to lower and usually put my foot on one side of the linkage to assist and to make sure it is down all the way prior to attaching the mmm.
 

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Can you hook up the other side of the cylinder? That could hook into the other side of the curl function on your loader control then you would have power up and down. Which is what the new "Command Cut" is on the new 2 series.
Command Cut uses a linear actuator, not hydraulics.
 

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My cylinder started acting the same but only not going down. A small restrictor was checked and found to be clear. The cylinder eventually bound up. I took the cylinder out to find it full of crud in side. Seems it was getting in thru the vent. Poor design. Another cylinder is in the works. I talked to hydraulics people about it and confirmed the crud is entering thru vent, poor position and location for it. The vent was drawing in thru the fine screen over time and destroyed the cylinder. Have fun getting another looking at $300 when all said and done from JD. Cylinder is made by Hanna company. Contacting them was like talking to the dog. Looking else where and I'll post when final.

In the mean time set the deck on tractor lifting with 2x4 and mow lawn without the lift feature.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Can you hook up the other side of the cylinder? That could hook into the other side of the curl function on your loader control then you would have power up and down. Which is what the new "Command Cut" is on the new 2 series. Good Luck Dont know if it can be done but if the cylinder has a plug it sounds doable to me>
Yeah, there were talks of seeing if we can make it into a DA cylinder, and running a second line over to the SCV ports haha. We'll see what happens though.

Just wondering , before removing the cylinder , did you happen to unplug the hyd connection and then plug in the connection again.. :dunno:

I've had hyd lift on several different JD sub compacts over the years. Of all the units I've always had to help lower the lift arms down for the MMM. :dunno: By using either my foot or hand pressing down on the lift arm at the same time moving the hyd lever.
Disconnected and reconnected several times, fittings cleaned, and even tried different ports on the mid-scv. Same problems. The mower deck or pressure from a foot or hand don't make it go any faster.

My cylinder started acting the same but only not going down. A small restrictor was checked and found to be clear. The cylinder eventually bound up. I took the cylinder out to find it full of crud in side. Seems it was getting in thru the vent. Poor design. Another cylinder is in the works. I talked to hydraulics people about it and confirmed the crud is entering thru vent, poor position and location for it. The vent was drawing in thru the fine screen over time and destroyed the cylinder. Have fun getting another looking at $300 when all said and done from JD. Cylinder is made by Hanna company. Contacting them was like talking to the dog. Looking else where and I'll post when final.

In the mean time set the deck on tractor lifting with 2x4 and mow lawn without the lift feature.
weird, I'm guessing this "vent" is the brass plug threaded into the cylinder side? We loosened it, and tried various things to see if that was the problem, no dice. Is the entire cylinder not rebuildable? I've not messed with hydraulic cylinders much, before this.
 

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Well, the problems keep rolling in this year. So, went to hook up the mower deck for the second time this year, and the pto assembly took for ever to drop down. I figured it might just be a fluke, and would clear up with the weight of the deck to pull it down. Well, it's not any better. Takes 5-10 seconds to go from the H on the sticker, to the fully raised position. What's the best way to troubleshoot this? Can I pull the hose off and flush it somehow, in case its something in there? Drop the cylinder itself? Ideas?
I reread your original post and realized you are having slow speed in both lower and raise.
The most logical thing that could cause low speed in both directions is dirt in the orifice at the cylinder. At the cylinder, where the hydraulic hose swivel is connected, there is an orifice inside the swivel nut of the hose fitting. Remove the hose connection at the cylinder and the orifice will be inside the female swivel nut. Get the orifice out of the swivel nut by simply tilting the hose connection, it should fall out. Clean the orifice really good, take the quick connect nipple off the other end of the hose and blow low pressure air through the hose. When doing this, you will blow all the residual oil out of the hose so put the cylinder end of the hose in a clean bucket to catch the oil. Once the oil is blown out of the hose, take a look at the oil and try to determine if there is any small particles of dirt in the oil.
Once everything is clean, reconnect and try it.

As a side note, it is very important to clean all dirt off the quick connect prior to making connections. I personally like penetrating oil like WD40 to clean the quick connects. If there is dirt inside the quick connects, this dirt can get push into the system which isn't good especially in circuits where there are orifices in the circuit.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Hmmm... That's interesting. That's not what the cylinder side of our set up looks like. There's about a half inch of what looks like hard line between the threaded end of the rubber hose, and the elbow going into the cylinder itself... Is that supposed to be on the quick disconnect side maybe?
 

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Yeah, .............

weird, I'm guessing this "vent" is the brass plug threaded into the cylinder side? We loosened it, and tried various things to see if that was the problem, no dice. Is the entire cylinder not rebuildable? I've not messed with hydraulic cylinders much, before this.
I checked out possibility of rebuilding the cylinder. Kinda cost prohibitive, to cut it open is close to 100 bucks and if the cylinder walls are bad it is a lost cause. So hydraulics guy suggested a new one. I explained the JD cost and he suggested go on line and source something that would fit. A dual action or single action unit could be used. In fact to hose in a dual action and not rely on the screen would help eliminate a problem.

See the screen allows the cylinder to suck and expell air as it cycles thus dirt makes it way in by not being a closed system.

I'm learning this as I go and not real happy with JD. A hydraulic cylinder should last for decades not couple hundred hours.
 

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Hmmm... That's interesting. That's not what the cylinder side of our set up looks like. There's about a half inch of what looks like hard line between the threaded end of the rubber hose, and the elbow going into the cylinder itself... Is that supposed to be on the quick disconnect side maybe?
It sounds like your hose may have a different make of fitting on the end of the hose. I doubt that this is a problem. The orifice is inside the swivel fitting that connects the hose to the cylinder.
Attached are the two installation guides for the mmm lift cylinder kit and the hose kit.
 

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Good call Ray! :bigthumb:
 

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I finished the job of replacing the mower deck lifting hydraulic cylinder. I said a while back I'd supply details on my out come. Be it than JD wanted a big stack of money and my first born for a new cylinder I decided to shop elsewhere. I settled for a Dalton #DBH-300-1504-WT welded cylinder 1.5 bore x 4 stroke @ $60 was $76.66 including shipping. Dalton cylinder is a bigger unit, double action (original cylinder was set up for single action) and looks like substantial assembly. I got another hose w/ fittings (see photo) to take advantage of dual action. Mounting the Dalton unit entailed me replace the JD mounting brace with a piece I fabricated myself. Dalton cylinder has 1" diameter ends so I chose a sleeve on rod end and cut down the width of the Dalton loop to fit the JD lever arm. The cylinder end I just pressed and welded a 1" diameter stainless pin into my new 1/4" double mounting plate. The 1" diameter pin just slips into the loop.

The only thing I forgot was the small restricted plates (that is item J in post #12) to slow down the up and down movement. Movement is too fast. I'm just too slow to leave them out.
 

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I finished the job of replacing the mower deck lifting hydraulic cylinder. I said a while back I'd supply details on my out come. Be it than JD wanted a big stack of money and my first born for a new cylinder I decided to shop elsewhere. I settled for a Dalton #DBH-300-1504-WT welded cylinder 1.5 bore x 4 stroke @ $60 was $76.66 including shipping. Dalton cylinder is a bigger unit, double action (original cylinder was set up for single action) and looks like substantial assembly. I got another hose w/ fittings (see photo) to take advantage of dual action. Mounting the Dalton unit entailed me replace the JD mounting brace with a piece I fabricated myself. Dalton cylinder has 1" diameter ends so I chose a sleeve on rod end and cut down the width of the Dalton loop to fit the JD lever arm. The cylinder end I just pressed and welded a 1" diameter stainless pin into my new 1/4" double mounting plate. The 1" diameter pin just slips into the loop.

The only thing I forgot was the small restricted plates (that is item J in post #12) to slow down the up and down movement. Movement is too fast. I'm just too slow to leave them out.

I just put in the .025" diameter restriction plate on the non rod end of the hydraulic cylinder and the up and down motion speed is perfect. A bit of hydraulic fluid to clean up spilled on mower deck but easy wipe up. I could not ask for it to be any different. I initially had the hoses reversed in the couplings. Repositioning the two hydraulic hoses in to the coupling so up is towards me and down is away, feels better and is more logical to me. But either way is ok functionally.
 
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