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I'll apologize in advance for the lengthy post....

I've been giving a LOT of thought to getting rid of my 15 year old Jeep Wrangler and getting a truck. Before the Jeep I had a '97 Ranger, before that was an '88 Ranger. While in college I had an early '70s F-100. And my parents had a '78 F-250 that I also drove from time to time in high school and college. I guess the point of this "history" is that I've always liked driving pickups. I forgot to mention my 1980 Subaru Brat which was a "truck wanna-be"! :laugh:

I know that used trucks are outrageously expensive so I've been debating about buying my "forever truck" (I'm 55 now) or buying something more along the beater lines to use around here for now and then buy the forever truck in a few years. I want to get either a 3/4 or 1 ton, at least a Super Cab.

Driving around last week, I drove through the lot of a local GMC dealer just to see what he had sitting there. I noticed an F-250 XL Super Cab 4x4 at the back of the lot. You could tell that it was a fresh trade so I went inside to ask about it. The salesman didn't even know it was back there and when he asked around he found out that it was a "fleet trade-in" and the sales guys hadn't gotten the info on it yet. I went back there today and still no info, but I kind of pushed the issue and they got with the fleet manager to get the keys, etc. The truck is super clean, no rust (a big deal here where we use salt on the roads!) and only has 80,000 miles. You could still see the outline of some vinyl lettering and I figured out it was a trade in from a small city outside of Cincinnati. I called that city earlier this week and talked to their maintenance guy who told me the truck had been serviced regularly and they only got rid of it because their policy is to trade in vehicles once they reach 10 years old. It was a lightly driven supervisor's truck.

I got on KBB.com and put in the specs. KBB says the "dealer retail" price on the truck should be somewhere in the $11-$13.5k range. Sounds good, right? KBB shows a list of "comparable vehicles" in my area so I click on the link. The closest thing I can find to "comparable" (same trim, cab, engine, etc.) is a truck with 100k on the odo and it looks like the inside of the bed rusted out and they replaced the metal with wood! :nunu: That truck was listed for sale at $16,900. There was nothing listed that was even close the $13.5.

I'm still waiting on my local dealer to come up with a price on the truck I found. They need to run it through their service department before they price it. Based on what I've seen with these other listings, I'm almost expecting a price somewhere around $18k or so. So, why is there such a discrepancy between KBB, Edmunds, etc. and "the real world"?

Should I just suck it up and pay the "market price" for a truck and assume it will hold it's value? Actually, when I bought my Jeep 10 years ago, I was shocked at those prices as well. I paid $12.5 for it then and could probably get $7500-8,500 now. Are pickups like Jeeps?

Or should I buy the "forever truck" now and spend somewhere around $45k for something that I would hope would last me until my kids take my keys from me?

Input is appreciated!
 

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I have had friends and relatives buy service vehicles in the past. A lot has to due with the financial health of the city and whether the vehicle was in fact a supervisors. My brother got a beautiful Crown Vic that was a supervisor vehicle and it was expertly maintained, a real tight machine.
Sounds like a great candidate if they don't jack you up on the price. I would still expect to be putting some maintenance into it. If you keep it decent it should still hold good value when you sell it.
I'm a sucker for new myself. I have a 2017 F350 sitting in the garage with 300 miles on it right now. You pay a fortune for one of those with a diesel but if you keep the miles down and take care of them they hold their value like no other domestic vehicle.
I'm not too sure about getting a new gas truck at this time with so many brands going to start-stop and cylinder deactivation and all that.

Be sure to let us know how they treat you.
 

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I'd go on line and spend some time on the web sites of the big three and GMC, and also Toyota, Nissan, and maybe Honda. Build a lot of trucks, and check out new prices.

You may find that there's not as large a money gap as you thought between used and a good deal on new. If you don't find a great deal on new, the time spent building will point out some things you might not have considered as you keep looking at used.

I did that a few months ago and ended up with a new GMC well under invoice, and even better, the dealer sent me an unexpected $1,000 check the next month for a GM sales incentive that they had missed.:pickup:

I'd think hard before buying a truck like the one you pictured. Those rear opening doors in the supercab are a real pain if you are loading people or groceries in the back seat in a parking lot.
 

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I'd buy a Nissan Titan XD Platinum Reserve Diesel 4dr crew for 60k, if you want a good forever truck.

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Those are nice trucks but I don't understand the pricing. I bought my 2017 Ram 2500 Laramie with the Cummins for less than I could have bought a 1/2 ton Nissan. My brand loyalty was destroyed by Ford recently but I could have bought a F350 with a PSD for the same money as well. So, nice trucks, but for a truck that can't begin to do what a 2500 or a F350 does, I don't understand how they're getting that price out of them.
 

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I recently helped my step-son buy a fleet maintained Ram; 2011 Ram 1500 W/ 300K miles. I have never seen an engine this well maintained. It was $6K under book (however, see below). We bought it and no issues or regrets. I would not hesitate to buy a fleet maintained vehicle that has records.

That brings me to the KBB's of the world. Autotrader bought KBB in 2010. I tried to sell a vehicle on AT once and it was a disaster. Only wholesalers called me. And they all grossly underbid the value of the car and always referred me to KBB values, which was significantly less than Edwards. Things that make you go hmmmmm....

So now I pull up all the appraisal guides and do an aggregate to get to the value.
 

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Those are nice trucks but I don't understand the pricing. I bought my 2017 Ram 2500 Laramie with the Cummins for less than I could have bought a 1/2 ton Nissan. My brand loyalty was destroyed by Ford recently but I could have bought a F350 with a PSD for the same money as well. So, nice trucks, but for a truck that can't begin to do what a 2500 or a F350 does, I don't understand how they're getting that price out of them.
You make a valid point, they are like a Raptor, aka over priced f150. I'm sticking with my z71 Silverado, good value for the $, although, I wish I had a longer bed than 5', the 4dr Crew cab is a good trade-off.

3025e
 

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Mark:

I'd say you're getting good advice, and it's a tough call as to whether to go new or used. I prefer new as I drive them till they die; but I choke at modern pickup truck prices and have a hard time with the thought of $50k, $60k, or more for one. I paid about $26k and change for the 1999 F-250 XLT 4x4 long bed super-cab with a V-10 and 5-speed manual when I ordered the truck. An online inflation calculator I use says that truck would be about $38k and change in 2017 dollars.

I guess you need to ask yourself the following questions:

1. Can I afford it?

2. Do I want or need it?

3. Do I normally trade vehicles frequently, or do I keep them until the wheels fall off?

4. How is my health, and is it realistic to buy such a truck to last you out?

5. Can you stomach the insurance costs and license fees? I know this varies around the country.

6. If you finance the thing, a used vehicle generally carries a shorter term and higher interest rate than a new vehicle that may result in similar payments. Of course you pay off the used one quicker; but if it's a sleeper lemon you may pay it off just in time to replace it.

Of course there are other questions to ask yourself. I have the rear opening doors, and we don't have kids and pets, so stuffing living things back there is not an issue for me. Yeah, there are times the doors could open wider, and if I were to do it again I'd probably get a crew-cab for the extra interior storage room; but a super-cab sure beats a regular cab any day.
 

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Those are nice trucks but I don't understand the pricing. I bought my 2017 Ram 2500 Laramie with the Cummins for less than I could have bought a 1/2 ton Nissan. My brand loyalty was destroyed by Ford recently but I could have bought a F350 with a PSD for the same money as well. So, nice trucks, but for a truck that can't begin to do what a 2500 or a F350 does, I don't understand how they're getting that price out of them.
Sounds like prices haven't changed much in 24 years. Back then I had a new 1993 Dodge W250 diesel 2 door 8' bed truck. It was a loaded LE model. One day I'm driving by a Toyota dealership with one of my friends. He sees a little pup truck out front and begged me to stop and look at it. Back then Toyota only sold compact trucks. It was also 4X4 and had all the options. Don't remember what the exact number but it was only like $3,000 cheeper then my truck. The Cummings engine option was around $3,000 and Toyota didn't even offer a diesel (in the US anyway). So comparing gas engines the trucks were around the same price. Like you stated no comparison between the two.

I'm also not a fan of the super cab trucks. The ones with the rear suicide doors. 4 door models have a B pillar that connects the roof to the floor. In my opinion this is a way stronger design. Especially if you are ever get T boned.
 

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I did exactly what one of your options are. I bought my "forever" truck when I was 52 years old and still working. It was the most extravagant purchases I ever made - paid close to what I paid for my house way back then.

And am I ever glad I did. Buying the truck got rid of the constant "want" when thinking about vehicles. I got every option available. 8 years later now and I have never wanted to even look at another vehicle.

My thinking was that I wouldn't be able to afford to do this once I retired - had planned on retiring at age 62. Well it worked out even better than I could have imagined - I came down with a disease at age 54 and had to stop working. I was able to pay it off in that transition.

My truck is still like new and feels like a new truck every time I drive it. And because of what happened and the timing, I will never be able to afford to buy such a truck ever again.

So yeah - I vote for the forever truck now. You never know what is going to happen between now and then........
 

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Mark, my .02, if you can afford new, I would not hesitate for a second. If this is going to be your last vehicle purchase, why not buy new. Put together a vehicle with what "you" want. Price variation (real world, book), is the nature of the beast, and a few other variables. You price that same vehicle in every lower 48, and you'll get 48 different prices.


As for buying new, the "cost" versus year is not much different than it was say 20 years ago when I bought my 1998 Silverado. I paid almost 30,000 for it in December of 1997. Fairly expensive for that time, but maybe because the extended cab, third door model was in it's infancy. Not sure though. Fast forward to March 2014. Signed the papers on a 2014 Silverado ( can you tell I'm a GM guy:)) stickered for a little over 45,000. With all the incentives and supplier discount, the actual out of pocket price came down to 35,000.:thumbup1gif: It's not "labeled an LTZ, just an LT with a really decent options package, but it's damn close, as it has almost everything the LTZ's have. So it almost works out inflation wise on these particular vehicles to be give or take 1,000 dollars a year. The rate that the majority of most all manufactured products increases in this country, I don't think this truck deal is all that bad.

Little did I know, that I would lose my job in February of 2016. My work commute was almost 80 miles daily. Now it's down to zero! I seriously thought of selling the truck, but my wife didn't want me too.:good2: The odometer read 36,061 miles when I was laid off, and now sitting in the garage, it reads 38,890.:) I'm 64 this year, so yeah, adding maybe 1,000 miles a year, I'm fairly certain this is my last vehicle.:)
 

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Mark, my .02, if you can afford new, I would not hesitate for a second. If this is going to be your last vehicle purchase, why not buy new. Put together a vehicle with what "you" want. Price variation (real world, book), is the nature of the beast, and a few other variables. You price that same vehicle in every lower 48, and you'll get 48 different prices.


As for buying new, the "cost" versus year is not much different than it was say 20 years ago when I bought my 1998 Silverado. I paid almost 30,000 for it in December of 1997. Fairly expensive for that time, but maybe because the extended cab, third door model was in it's infancy. Not sure though. Fast forward to March 2014. Signed the papers on a 2014 Silverado ( can you tell I'm a GM guy:)) stickered for a little over 45,000. With all the incentives and supplier discount, the actual out of pocket price came down to 35,000.:thumbup1gif: It's not "labeled an LTZ, just the LT, but it's damn close, as it has almost everything the LTZ's have. So it almost works out inflation wise on these particular vehicles to be give or take 1,000 dollars a year. The rate that the majority of most all manufactured products increases in this country, I don't think this truck deal is all that bad.

Little did I know, that I would lose my job in February of 2016. My work commute was almost 80 miles daily. Now it's down to zero! I seriously thought of selling the truck, but my wife didn't want me too.:good2: The odometer read 36,061 miles when I was laid off, and now sitting in the garage, it reads 38,890. I'm 64 this year, so yeah, I'm fairly certain this is my last vehicle.:)
Our experience are similar Greg.

Times were really tough the first couple years not working and considered selling my truck also (among other things). Like you, my wife insisted I keep it. This was my dream truck, my retirement truck, and represented many years of hard work. I am so glad I kept it. And like yours, mine sits in the barn most of the time. I put 5k miles a year on it now and most of that is because of long distance doctor appointments.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
THANKS to everyone that replied!! I appreciate your insights probably more than you realize! :bigthumb:

I tend to keep my vehicles a long time. My '88 Ranger was sold in '99 (it had 225k on the odo). My '97 Ranger (bought in '99) was driven by me until '07 when I bought my '02 Jeep, but my older daughter drove the '97 Ranger until a couple years ago - then I donated it to a local charity that's still using it (with about 240k on the odo). I've been driving the '02 Jeep for 10 years now - 195k on it.

I used to drive a ton of miles for my job as a software consultant. But now, with technology, I do most of my job from home since I can log on remotely to my clients' systems now. Now I'm only putting 10k or so a year on a vehicle. So I could conceivably get a lifetime out of a well maintained vehicle. My only concern is would I want to replace it after 10 years - which for many people is a long time to keep a vehicle - or would I be happy keeping it longer? So, that's a point I definitely need to think about.

It is time to do something though. The Jeep is starting to need more frequent repairs. Plus, it's got a 3" lift and 33" tires, so it's taking a little more effort to get in and out of it. Plus, I'm limited as to what I can tow with it. That's generally not a problem with my 5x8 trailer, but I would like to get back to a truck again.

Stan - your situation is something that has definitely crossed my mind as I'm working through this. You and I are about the same age (I'll be 55 next month) so one never knows what will happen. I've already seen a decline in Sweetie as she's fighting fibro-myalgia or something similar that leaves her in some sort of pain on a daily basis. So the "buy it now and enjoy it a long time" view of things is something that is in the forefront for me.

THANKS again to everyone for chiming in - and keep the opinions coming!

-Mark.
 

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Mark -

I'll be honest - I smile to myself every time I go do the barn and see my truck which is 8 years old now.

For the last 4-5 years I was running my winter set of wheels/tires. They are getting quite worn now so I installed the factory set that have never seen winter and still have 9/32" of tread. When I stood back to look - like a new truck feeling once again!

IMG_0149.JPG

I got every option avaialbe when I bought it knowing I probably wouldn't use 1/2 of them. Bit as it turns out I really like it all. I've never had automatic climate control before - now I would be hard pressed to live without it.

There is really only 1 or 2 things that are available now that weren't when I bought mine. Like power folding mirrors. I have the big trailer tow mirrors (which I would also not want to be without even not towing a trailer) and I have to fold one side in to fit through my barn door.

When I get my truck serviced at the Ford dealer I always take a cruise through the lot while waiting. Out of dozens on new trucks I have never gotten the "wants" while looking.

I feel for your wife Mark - I suspect that I have Fibromyalgia also along with my RA which is common. I literally had never been sick in my life. I recall calling in sick for 2 days many years ago after catching a stomach virus that everyone had at work - that was it! Then around age 52 I started having some serious joint pain but did nothing about it. Just kept pushing through as I did all my life. It eventually got so bad after 2 years that I literally couldn't climb into the truck. And that was it. Came home from work one day and couldn't go back the next.
 

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in 10yrs we will be likely to be forced into autocars. cars that drive for you... look at the rate they are going. trucks that back up a trailer for you ,brake for you, change lanes for you ,decide the distance you can be from another car,warn and beep at you for everything,turn off at every stop then restart when you touch the throttle, keep track of were your at ect ect

so moral of story if you want the freedom to still drive a truck buy now:kidw_truck_smiley:
 

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in 10yrs we will be likely to be forced into autocars. cars that drive for you... look at the rate they are going. trucks that back up a trailer for you ,brake for you, change lanes for you ,decide the distance you can be from another car,warn and beep at you for everything,turn off at every stop then restart when you touch the throttle, keep track of were your at ect ect

so moral of story if you want the freedom to still drive a truck buy now:kidw_truck_smiley:
I was talking to a Chrysler tech the other day. He said that the new Pacifica hybrid minivans have 62 computers in them. He also said that it has lane sensing systems, auto turning systems and the like.



I don't like this new tech, weather its in tractors or cars.
 

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I was talking to a Chrysler tech the other day. He said that the new Pacifica hybrid minivans have 62 computers in them. He also said that it has lane sensing systems, auto turning systems and the like.



I don't like this new tech, weather its in tractors or cars.


Scary isn't it. lol

I'm dreading the generations of new "drivers" all this technology is going to handicap. And I use the term drivers very loosely. I can't drive a vehicle with a manual transmission will spawn into I can't drive a vehicle that doesn't
Have a back up camera with alarms when I'm getting to close.
Puts the brakes on for me because I can't be trusted to.
Parallel parks itself.
Sounds an alarm when I drift into another lane. Seeing I'll be too busy texting it better also correct itself.
Has a 22" tv screen so I can watch movies.
Has cruise control that will slow my car down to keep from hitting the one in front of me.
Automatically downloads all my favorite music
Has a rear seat entertainment system, video games and wireless headsets. So I never have to yell sit down and shut up or I'm turning this car around!
Unlocks, opens and closes the doors with my thoughts. Absolutely no keys.
Decides for itself weather it should be running the engine or not.
Tells me if a tire is flat. Then calls the auto club for repair.
Emails the dealership when it needs service.
Is it's own internet hot spot.
Have voice command for everything. Especially reading and writing texts.
Have GPS to tell me where to go.
And another 10 features that I forgot to mention. lol
 

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Scary isn't it. lol

I'm dreading the generations of new "drivers" all this technology is going to handicap. And I use the term drivers very loosely. I can't drive a vehicle with a manual transmission will spawn into I can't drive a vehicle that doesn't
Have a back up camera with alarms when I'm getting to close.
Puts the brakes on for me because I can't be trusted to.
Parallel parks itself.
Sounds an alarm when I drift into another lane. Seeing I'll be too busy texting it better also correct itself.
Has a 22" tv screen so I can watch movies.
Has cruise control that will slow my car down to keep from hitting the one in front of me.
Automatically downloads all my favorite music
Has a rear seat entertainment system, video games and wireless headsets. So I never have to yell sit down and shut up or I'm turning this car around!
Unlocks, opens and closes the doors with my thoughts. Absolutely no keys.
Decides for itself weather it should be running the engine or not.
Tells me if a tire is flat. Then calls the auto club for repair.
Emails the dealership when it needs service.
Is it's own internet hot spot.
Have voice command for everything. Especially reading and writing texts.
Have GPS to tell me where to go.
And another 10 features that I forgot to mention. lol

Well Said!
 

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in 10yrs we will be likely to be forced into autocars. cars that drive for you... look at the rate they are going. trucks that back up a trailer for you ,brake for you, change lanes for you ,decide the distance you can be from another car,warn and beep at you for everything,turn off at every stop then restart when you touch the throttle, keep track of were your at ect ect

so moral of story if you want the freedom to still drive a truck buy now:kidw_truck_smiley:
Scary isn't it. lol

I'm dreading the generations of new "drivers" all this technology is going to handicap. And I use the term drivers very loosely. I can't drive a vehicle with a manual transmission will spawn into I can't drive a vehicle that doesn't
Have a back up camera with alarms when I'm getting to close.
Puts the brakes on for me because I can't be trusted to.
Parallel parks itself.
Sounds an alarm when I drift into another lane. Seeing I'll be too busy texting it better also correct itself.
Has a 22" tv screen so I can watch movies.
Has cruise control that will slow my car down to keep from hitting the one in front of me.
Automatically downloads all my favorite music
Has a rear seat entertainment system, video games and wireless headsets. So I never have to yell sit down and shut up or I'm turning this car around!
Unlocks, opens and closes the doors with my thoughts. Absolutely no keys.
Decides for itself weather it should be running the engine or not.
Tells me if a tire is flat. Then calls the auto club for repair.
Emails the dealership when it needs service.
Is it's own internet hot spot.
Have voice command for everything. Especially reading and writing texts.
Have GPS to tell me where to go.
And another 10 features that I forgot to mention. lol
We are the BORG, your life as you have known it is over. You will be assimilated to serve US.

I have real mixed feelings about self driving vehicles; but I won't derail this thread going off on that tangent.
 
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