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Discussion Starter #1
My new x758 has worked great for the first 40 hours. But now, the blades cut off while mowing for no reason. The past 3 times I’ve tried to mow my grass, the blades have cut off and I borrow a neighbor’s push mower which sucks. The grass isn’t high, I’m not getting off the chair, not backing up without RIO pressed, etc. I can typically re-engage the blades but they cut off 5 seconds later. So to cut one circle around my house takes about 15 re-engagements. I’ve taken the deck off and rode with the PTO engaged and it still cuts off. The dash doesn’t kick off any codes and the PTO light just flashes. Took it to the dealer and of course they can’t reproduce it. Anybody experienced this or can think of why this could be happening?
 

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X758 pto cut out

The PTO will not engage if the brake is set. Check that switch to see if it is marginal and cutting out the PTO when you press the brake pedal or hit a bump even without locking it. try taking that switch out of circuit to see if it goes away.
 

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I had a problem with my X595 and X590 with the seat switch. It's so sensitive that when I would lean one side or the other it would cut the pto off. Hated to do it but had to bypass it.
 

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The pto will also shut off if your engine is overheating. Check your radiator and screen. When it gets near the red it will shut off the blades to reduce load on the engine. Check that first.

Sent from my LGL52VL using Tapatalk
On the X700s the engine shuts off if it starts to overheat, not just the PTO.
 

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Never experienced that. Never mentioned during training. I will have to look into that.

Sent from my LGL52VL using Tapatalk
In the owners manual, it says

""Coolant Temperature Gauge - indicates temperature of cooling system. If needle on gauge reaches red range, the engine is overheating. If PTO is engaged, it will automatically shut off.

If engine is overheated, disengage PTO, let engine cool at idle speed until needle returns to green range. Shut off engine and clean air intake screens and radiator screen. ""

As you mentioned, This has been a feature of these machines for many models and goes back over 20 years. To me, Having the engine stop running because it's overheating seems counter productive to any attempts to properly cool an overheated engine down.......

I didn't see anything about the engine ceasing operation when overheated as any sort of factory designed or intended damage prevention feature.......Everything which talks about the engine stopping running mentions a possible defect of the "Safety Interlock Circuit".......So if that is actually happening to an overheated X7XX series machine, it sounds more like a defect in the "Safety Interlock Circuit" than it does shutting off the engine when overheated being an intended response.

Granted, eventually, every engine which is overheated will shutdown if the overheating continues uninterrupted. But usually, the overheating is a combination of restricted airflow or cooling system compromised and engine load. By reducing the load, the engine usually cools down even with the radiator screen and side panels obstructed. Certainly, cleaning the radiator screen and side panels / air intakes helps expedite the cooling process with the engine running.

The manual actually instructs the operator to shut off the engine to clean the radiator screen and any other obstructions as a matter of safety, in reality, I know I always carefully pull the radiator screen and blow off the radiator and screen and entire area with my hand held gas powered blower......while the machine engine is running..:hide:
 

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In the owners manual, it says

""Coolant Temperature Gauge - indicates temperature of cooling system. If needle on gauge reaches red range, the engine is overheating. If PTO is engaged, it will automatically shut off.

If engine is overheated, disengage PTO, let engine cool at idle speed until needle returns to green range. Shut off engine and clean air intake screens and radiator screen. ""

As you mentioned, This has been a feature of these machines for many models and goes back over 20 years. To me, Having the engine stop running because it's overheating seems counter productive to any attempts to properly cool an overheated engine down.......

I didn't see anything about the engine ceasing operation when overheated as any sort of factory designed or intended damage prevention feature.......Everything which talks about the engine stopping running mentions a possible defect of the "Safety Interlock Circuit".......So if that is actually happening to an overheated X7XX series machine, it sounds more like a defect in the "Safety Interlock Circuit" than it does shutting off the engine when overheated being an intended response.

Granted, eventually, every engine which is overheated will shutdown if the overheating continues uninterrupted. But usually, the overheating is a combination of restricted airflow or cooling system compromised and engine load. By reducing the load, the engine usually cools down even with the radiator screen and side panels obstructed. Certainly, cleaning the radiator screen and side panels / air intakes helps expedite the cooling process with the engine running.

The manual actually instructs the operator to shut off the engine to clean the radiator screen and any other obstructions as a matter of safety, in reality, I know I always carefully pull the radiator screen and blow off the radiator and screen and entire area with my hand held gas powered blower......while the machine engine is running..:hide:
10-4 Sulley. Thank you.

Sent from my LGL52VL using Tapatalk
 

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I know some of the older machines would shut down. For instance the old 318 generation. I want to say there is some thermal breaker that would trip. Also there is a known issue where kind of like circuit breaker. The more you trip it the easier it is to trip and you are better off just replacing it.

Also on my X585 the overheating thing can't be in the cluster. If it does it, it has to be in the ECU somewhere because my cluster had issues and it would show the temp gauge pegged out and it would keep running. PTO and all. However the coolant temp sensor would have been reporting a resistance in the safe range so maybe that is why the PTO wouldn't cut out.

I guess my thought is it could be a flaky connection or switch. When it cuts out, is it fine if it sits for a while. For instance if you stop for a break and then can't get the PTO going right away unless you wait a bit?

I ask because while it is a different machine, the ZTraks sometimes do this when the PTO Switch is going out. Mine did this. It was still under warranty and I don't recall the order in which things were replaced but I got a new PTO Clutch and PTO Switch. I want to say one of them was swapped out and the issue persisted and then they swapped the other. I don't recall which was first but if the PTO switch is similar it might be the issue. Though I would hate to start swapping out parts as guess work as that can get expensive.
 

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In the owners manual, it says

""Coolant Temperature Gauge - indicates temperature of cooling system. If needle on gauge reaches red range, the engine is overheating. If PTO is engaged, it will automatically shut off.

If engine is overheated, disengage PTO, let engine cool at idle speed until needle returns to green range. Shut off engine and clean air intake screens and radiator screen. ""

As you mentioned, This has been a feature of these machines for many models and goes back over 20 years. To me, Having the engine stop running because it's overheating seems counter productive to any attempts to properly cool an overheated engine down.......

I didn't see anything about the engine ceasing operation when overheated as any sort of factory designed or intended damage prevention feature.......Everything which talks about the engine stopping running mentions a possible defect of the "Safety Interlock Circuit".......So if that is actually happening to an overheated X7XX series machine, it sounds more like a defect in the "Safety Interlock Circuit" than it does shutting off the engine when overheated being an intended response.

Granted, eventually, every engine which is overheated will shutdown if the overheating continues uninterrupted. But usually, the overheating is a combination of restricted airflow or cooling system compromised and engine load. By reducing the load, the engine usually cools down even with the radiator screen and side panels obstructed. Certainly, cleaning the radiator screen and side panels / air intakes helps expedite the cooling process with the engine running.

The manual actually instructs the operator to shut off the engine to clean the radiator screen and any other obstructions as a matter of safety, in reality, I know I always carefully pull the radiator screen and blow off the radiator and screen and entire area with my hand held gas powered blower......while the machine engine is running..:hide:


Good post!:greentractorride:

The only thing I would add is I also use a gas blower to blow the machine off after use. If the engine is running, the grass in the radiator is much hard to get rid of as the fan is holding the debris in to the radiator and screen. If you shut if off it comes out easily. I also blow from the engine side and dislodge anything you can't see. Cotton wood seed is the only thing I have seen make the temp climb, then it was pretty minimal.
 

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Have you tried the reverse bypass of the PTO? I think you lift the PTO switch and hold it up? :dunno: Mine was bypassed by the former owner :flag_of_truce:is why I am uncertain of it's operation.
 

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On the X700s the engine shuts off if it starts to overheat, not just the PTO.
Well, it shuts off the PTO first. I've had that happen numerous times. Mowing along and all of a sudden I realize that the mower wasn't spinning for the last XX feet of the round. (I use noise cancelling headphones so I don't hear the change in sound.)

For the OP, if the orange warning symbol is flashing on the dash and the temp gauge is up to the last 2 bars or so then that is likely your problem. These X7-series tractors pull in a LOT of air and the radiator debris screen plugs up fast.

Rob
 

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Discussion Starter #13
The dealer was unable to reproduce the issue over the span of 2 days. They were loading it up to bring it to me today, and tried one more time, and presto the blades cut off. They determined it to be a bad PTO solenoid. It's on order from John Deere so hopefully I'll get the machine back next week and the issue wont' reappear. Thanks for all the advice guys.
 

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I have had my hands in many of these units. I can count on one finger the number of solenoids that went bad. May be.. I aint there. Run it.. Run it run it.

Sent from my LGL52VL using Tapatalk
 

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Discussion Starter #15
So the blades have cutoff again like before. Back to the dealership it goes. How many times would you guys go in for the same repair before escalating the issue? Makes me think something mechanical is causing the solenoid to malfunction. Thanks
 

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So the blades have cutoff again like before. Back to the dealership it goes. How many times would you guys go in for the same repair before escalating the issue? Makes me think something mechanical is causing the solenoid to malfunction. Thanks
Intermittent things like this can be tough. By chance do you notice it cuts out after say hitting a bump or something?

Odds are it isn't the solenoid. I doubt the x758 is much different than my older x585 in terms of how they do things. That isn't that much different than my my Z950R.

The way things work is there are several sensors in series that all have to maintain continuity in order to hold the relay in position to keep the PTO going. All it takes is a brief interruption in this circuit to cause the relay to drop out and the PTO to cut out. Even if that interruption is very brief, it won't restart unless you reset the PTO switch.

Here is a test to eliminate the solenoid. As someone mentioned the RIO Switch (Reverse Implement Operation) works by holding up on the PTO switch. Next time you mow, hold up on the PTO switch and stuff something under it to keep it up. You can stuff some paper or some people stuff the rubbery key chain advertising that many dealers include with the key under there. Many do this to get around the PTO cutting out with the reverse operation without doing a full bypass. If it doesn't cut out, it likely isn't a solenoid which I doubt anyhow. It could be one of the other sensors like the reverse switch or seat switch that has an intermittent failure or a loose connection. It could be a wire pinched somewhere. Like I said it can be tough to find and may require a few trips to the dealer and patience. More if they can't reproduce it. Just because it can't be found the first time, doesn't mean they don't know what they are doing. I have had a bad dealer experience but I wouldn't write them off simply because of this as it can be tricky. I had a wire rub that was blowing my EFI fuse on my X585. It would short out every now and then but always happened when I hit a bump. Not every bump but everytime it blew it was when I hit a bump. That helped narrow down to a wire rub. To find it I stripped the machine of all plastic and with it running went around shaking and tapping the harness until it died. Then I inspected that section of harness and saw a slight rub where the harness was touching the lift point on the engine. I used liquid electric tape on the wire, regular electrical tape and then put that section of the harness in a wire loom.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Thanks sennister, that is very informative. I actually did hit a bump when the blades cut off but nothing severe. That makes me think wiring too. They just called and said not the solenoid this time. They are going to replace the PTO switch and if that doesn't fix it the ECU is next.
 

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Have you tried the reverse bypass of the PTO? I think you lift the PTO switch and hold it up? :dunno: Mine was bypassed by the former owner :flag_of_truce:is why I am uncertain of it's operation.
I believe all the newer X750/58s have an override button as well, besides the holding up on the engagement lever. Both methods seem to work.

I would start with pushing that button. Maybe even try holding it in and see if it still manages to cut the pto off wile the override button is engaged.

I believe it could be a few different safety items that could need adjusted or maybe switches replaced. Seat safety switch, reverse pedal, etc.

There are some how to video's on YouTube that show how to permanently override that stupid reverse safety. I call it a stupid safety, because why is it safe to back up a Zero turn with the blades turning and not safe to back up a lawn tractor with the blades turning. Does not make any sense at all to me why that safety is even on there.
 
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